With the Pressure is Benitez Gone..?

[Andy @ Allerton]

With some of our (IMO) so Called Moronic "fans", the media, some of our Ex-players and results all clumping together in one seething melting pot of impotent rage, will Rafa be forced out of the door? No doubt if he goes then there will be some delighted people out there (Non more-so than the media that have had it in for 'Johnny Foreigner' Benitez from day one).

 

Personally, as I've said, I feel that if Benitez goes then the 'owners' will do nothing other than get a simpering yes man so they can continue to drag the club down the road they have set it on. Gone will be any complaints from a manger that will see his best players sold under him and will be forced (Like Benitez in recent seasons) to scratch the bottom of the barrel and look in the bargain basement for bargains.

 

When (I don't even think it's an "if" anymore) he goes I seriously worry for our club.

 

No Money. Massive debt. Incompetent Owners. No real future.

 

When he goes, I think midtable will be a major achievement for us. Let's face it, given the march that Manchester United and Chelsea have on us, it's going to be nigh-on impossible to catch them anytime within the next decade (Maybe more, maybe much more) and even Manchester City, Villa, Spurs, Sunderland and Arsenal are going to be ahead of us year-on-year. There are also rumours of other buy-outs from 'lesser' clubs out there - so I think it's a very real possibility that we may finish each season below 11th.

 

Watch this space. Can't see it being pretty.

[Flasher]

Nonsense.

 

If Rafa goes there will be a queue of top managers wanting the job.

[Andy @ Allerton]

Nonsense.

 

If Rafa goes there will be a queue of top managers wanting the job.

 

 

They'll be lured here by the treasure chest bulging with loot to sign new players with..

Edited January 14, 2010 by Andy

[Flasher]

They'll be lured here because it's Liverpool football club and we have a squad that inlcudes Reina, Agger, Carra, Johnson, Yossi, Maxi, Mascherano, Aquilani, Gerrard, Torres, Babel, Kuyt, Riera, Aurelio, not to mention excellent training ground and youth academy and excellent support.

[Fagan]

With some of our (IMO) so Called Moronic "fans", the media, some of our Ex-players and results all clumping together in one seething melting pot of impotent rage, will Rafa be forced out of the door? No doubt if he goes then there will be some delighted people out there (Non more-so than the media that have had it in for 'Johnny Foreigner' Benitez from day one).

 

Personally, as I've said, I feel that if Benitez goes then the 'owners' will do nothing other than get a simpering yes man so they can continue to drag the club down the road they have set it on. Gone will be any complaints from a manger that will see his best players sold under him and will be forced (Like Benitez in recent seasons) to scratch the bottom of the barrel and look in the bargain basement for bargains.

 

When (I don't even think it's an "if" anymore) he goes I seriously worry for our club.

 

No Money. Massive debt. Incompetent Owners. No real future.

 

When he goes, I think midtable will be a major achievement for us. Let's face it, given the march that Manchester United and Chelsea have on us, it's going to be nigh-on impossible to catch them anytime within the next decade (Maybe more, maybe much more) and even Manchester City, Villa, Spurs, Sunderland and Arsenal are going to be ahead of us year-on-year. There are also rumours of other buy-outs from 'lesser' clubs out there - so I think it's a very real possibility that we may finish each season below 11th.

 

Watch this space. Can't see it being pretty.

 

 

I cant agree with most of this really.

 

what exactly is moronic about our fans and ex players seething at the current state of the teams performances and league position, being out of the FA cup and CL at the start of January? if anything, not to be seething about it is moronic and raises serious questions about whether you have the correct expectations for the team.

 

I believe that at this stage, rafa should probably go, and will go during the summer. Its clear our squad is not good enough and can not compete with the other 'top 3' tihs season. last season it more than competed but something is rotten in anfield. The players are not responding to rafa. and unfortunately whether its their fault or rafa's fault, it will always be the manager who will have to fall on his sword or be made walk the plank. if he does go, I will be gutted, just like I was when Ged left. I love the man but things are not going to his plan and it seems we are going backwards rather than forwards.

 

i certainly do not agree that if rafa goes we will become a mid table team! there is no basis or logic for that at all. Just look at what a new manager can bring to a team. Rafa, won the CL with Houllier's bunch of misfits! thats what a new manager can do to a team who have underperformed under an old regime.

 

a new manager, like hiddink or Mourinho would provide a massive injection into the dressing room and on the pitch and would give us the chance to wipoe the slate clean, get rid of some of the sh*te that is currently in our 1st team and squad and start motoring forward again.

Edited January 14, 2010 by Fagan

[Gunga Din]

the only moronic fans we have are those who will happily accept mediocrity with a stupid f***ing grin on their faces thinking they are some kind of superfan becauthey wont criticise anyone, when they reality is they have such a poor grasp of the game they dont actually understand what is happening.

 

and i wish when people are on ignore and others quote them, you wouldnt have to read their post. although at least it makes me realise why he is on ignore. bulls*** from the first word to the last

Edited January 14, 2010 by Gunga Din

[Boca]

Jesus you nearly gave me a heart attack with the thread title.

[sean]

Presently it's disgusting. All of it. On the field, off the field, in the dug-out. Disgusting. Attitudes wrong, poor management of the squad and shambolic behind the scenes carry-on. I can't recall being disgusted by the whole lot. I'm there now.

[Hightown Phil]

and i wish when people are on ignore and others quote them, you wouldnt have to read their post. although at least it makes me realise why he is on ignore. bulls*** from the first word to the last

 

I've read it. Then read what you said. And then read it back.

 

I'm struggling to find the bulls***. For me it's what's going to happen.

[Davvo]

If that's not an attention seeking thread title.........

[mally]

s*** thread title

[MarkD]

Like all decisions, there is a time when you have to make them.

 

I fully understand the context of ownership and funding, squad quality and depth, injuries and form and the extent each influencesthe other and what is then produced on the pitch. However, to a lesser or greater extent, the majority of sporting teams suffer all or some of these things so whilst our "plight" is great it is not totally unique.

 

I have not come out and said we should change the manager for a number of reasons (including the fact that I think he is the right man for the job) and despite the fact that at times he frustrates the hell out of me. I also admire his stubborn streak and disregard for the old boys club that operates within the sport. I watched the game last night and felt embarrased/ashamed at the performance and experienced for the first time a desire for change of manager. Not because I have come to think of him as a poor manager but he is too entrenched in this malaise to fix it, in my opinion.

 

For the whole of this season, we have struggled - lack of imagination, pace, craft and guile. We have no squad depth - and by that I don't man like for like replacements but the gap between a strong first eleven and the rest is too big, we have players guaranteed starts irrespective of performance, we have selections that are diffciult to justify and we have the name and reputation of the club meaning less and less as the season goes on. Of course, Rafa is not the cause of all of this but he is culpable for some of it - and that is my problem with him at the moment. We do not dominate, control, show 'game intelligence'. We do not display a 'winning mentality', a desire, a passion. We do none of these things this season - irrespectve of the standard of the opposition. This is his responsibility. If a team tries and works and runs and tackles and demonstrates an improvement and a desire to end such a slump - even if results don't bear this out - I'd appreciate it and see how the manager is imparting his knowledge and craft into making things better. I fail to see this.

 

Of course, the players have a responsibility to this too but given the nature of the game and the fact that it can be easier to replace one rather than many, it is the manager upon whom poor results weight most heavily. He selects them, coaches and trains them, motivates them, prepares them.

 

I've no idea if any of the above makes sense. I've no idea who might/would/could replace Rafa - a man I respect and had hoped who build something lasting and successful here - but I think the time has come to contemplate change before the damage is too great.

[Andy @ Allerton]

s*** thread title

 

 

Fair enough. Updated.

[Mr. Biscan]

Wayne knows

[Red Kent]

The fans dont need to pressure him, he's doing a brilliant job by himself.

 

The majority of the players he buys are poor.

His tactics are cautious and negative.

The players are not playing for the shirt or him anymore.

He has his favourites and they get better treatment.

 

We are already heading for 11th under this manager. We have won 5 out of the last 21 games with no sign of that stat improving.

[Falconhoof]

We need a new manager. We are too far into the season now to assume he will turn this around.

[Bromage]

the only moronic fans we have are those who will happily accept mediocrity with a stupid f***ing grin on their faces thinking they are some kind of superfan becauthey wont criticise anyone, when they reality is they have such a poor grasp of the game they dont actually understand what is happening.

 

 

IMHO very few fans accept what you describe as mediocrity but many don't necessarily subscribe to the view that the only way to change this is to replace the manager. No matter whose figures you believe, based on Rafa's budget when compared to the other so-called "top teams", we certainly DID punch above our weight last season and his success over 5 years by anyone's standards, surely can't be ignored and solely based on this season alone. I really don't see the best quality managers clamouring for this job under the circumstances but certainly those desperate for work would.

 

My personal view is that Rafa will be here untl the end of the season, unless we lose the next 2 games. Whichever happens, Purslow will ask Kenny to assist in the process of selecting a new manager and act as the interim meanwhile. Of course the only likelyhood od a different outcome would be new ownership and that doesn't seem likely any time soon. I don't believe Rafa owes this club anything, in many ways similar to Houller but I suspect he is going to shortly reach a stage where he'll have had enough and he'll do what he wants to do. He is a man who loves the club and the city and has endured the owners and their imcompetence whilst still delivering on the pitch, until now. He doesn't stay for the money because he could earn as much if not more back in Spain or indeed in Italy.

 

So my advice is be careful what you wish for because if Klinnsman was their choice 2 years ago, unless Kenny has an influence in the choice of a replacement, then you may end up feeling very sick indeed.

[Murphman]

They'll be lured here because it's Liverpool football club and we have a squad that inlcudes Reina, Agger, Carra, Johnson, Yossi, Maxi, Mascherano, Aquilani, Gerrard, Torres, Babel, Kuyt, Riera, Aurelio, not to mention excellent training ground and youth academy and excellent support.

 

 

Eight of those fourteen either didn't play at all or lasted 45 minutes last night. Just saying like, it was a poor show but let's not ignore the missing personnel.

[John am Rhein]

His tactics are cautious and negative.

 

well, at least he got that right

[Hightown Phil]

The majority of the players he buys are poor.

 

Given that the majority of players he's got in are poor, and we finished second last season, surely that means he must be doing something right tactically?

 

Either that, or they're not poor at all, you can't have it both ways.

Edited January 14, 2010 by Hightown Phil

[Flasher]

Eight of those fourteen either didn't play at all or lasted 45 minutes last night. Just saying like, it was a poor show but let's not ignore the missing personnel.

 

You're right of course, but the team was still good enough to beat a team struggling inthe championship.

 

I stand by the fact that there is strill plenty to lure any manager to this club.

[Red Kent]

Given that the majority of players he's got in are poor, and we finished second last season, surely that means he must be doing something right tactically?

 

Either that, or they're not poor at all, you can't have it both ways.

 

OK so what is it then ?

 

We have lost Arbeloa and Alonso from the starting XI. Replaced them with two players who in my opinion are worse.

 

Insua is now first choice left back - wrong.

 

Ngog is now second choice striker - wrong.

 

The Gerrard / Torres thing worked a treat last season, it's been sussed this season and he appears incapable of changing the system.

 

I dont rate Ngog, but would much rather see him upfront with Torres and put Gerrard in back in midfield.

 

Without Torres or Gerrard we are relegation candidate looking team.

[Hassony]

Rafa needs a minimum of 6 points from the stoke and spurs games

 

 

[Eskimo]

IMHO very few fans accept what you describe as mediocrity but many don't necessarily subscribe to the view that the only way to change this is to replace the manager. No matter whose figures you believe, based on Rafa's budget when compared to the other so-called "top teams", we certainly DID punch above our weight last season and his success over 5 years by anyone's standards, surely can't be ignored and solely based on this season alone. I really don't see the best quality managers clamouring for this job under the circumstances but certainly those desperate for work would.

 

My personal view is that Rafa will be here untl the end of the season, unless we lose the next 2 games. Whichever happens, Purslow will ask Kenny to assist in the process of selecting a new manager and act as the interim meanwhile. Of course the only likelyhood od a different outcome would be new ownership and that doesn't seem likely any time soon. I don't believe Rafa owes this club anything, in many ways similar to Houller but I suspect he is going to shortly reach a stage where he'll have had enough and he'll do what he wants to do. He is a man who loves the club and the city and has endured the owners and their imcompetence whilst still delivering on the pitch, until now. He doesn't stay for the money because he could earn as much if not more back in Spain or indeed in Italy.

 

So my advice is be careful what you wish for because if Klinnsman was their choice 2 years ago, unless Kenny has an influence in the choice of a replacement, then you may end up feeling very sick indeed.

 

Aye I agree...good post btw

[muleskinner]

Fat Tom has said Klinsmann will never be manager, I want to believe he is being honest about this.