The US President

[smithdown]

Just now, New York Red said:

Quieter? No. Adopting positions that actually have a chance of becoming reality? Yes.
 

It doesn’t need to resonate with Republicans. That’s a waste of time. Things need to resonate with Democrats and independents. 

 

so if Ilhan changed her position and started saying that we need to look carefully not only at what we can afford but whether things like healthcare and a police force that treats everyone the same are even American and not like socialist ideas from abroad then she can say what she likes

 

Because I think some people who don’t vote Democrat would still find a problem with her, that she looks weird or maybe married her brother to get in the country or something I don’t know I’m just making mad ideas up as I go along.

 

For me I would say she is a remarkable woman for having not had a breakdown already considering the d****eads who try to silence her in order to appeal to a load of Qanon c**** 

 

[Redwire]

20 hours ago, New York Red said:

Ummmm, no you don’t. What she and Ilhan can do is to embrace less controversial positions rather than ones that have no chance of becoming law and which get used by the right to boost their campaigns.

The present situation sucks. The voters who look and sound like her have gotten the shaft repeatedly. But championing views that have no chance of happening is pointless. It sucks, but it is pointless.

Wow

[PaulMcC186]

20 hours ago, New York Red said:

Quieter? No. Adopting positions that actually have a chance of becoming reality? Yes.
 

It doesn’t need to resonate with Republicans. That’s a waste of time. Things need to resonate with Democrats and independents. 

Does her policies resonate with you?

Edited November 7, 2021 by PaulMcC186

[New York Red]

2 hours ago, PaulMcC186 said:

Does her policies resonate with you?

For the hundredth time, pretty much yes. I don’t disagree with much with her. In fact, I have a number of what would be labeled as radical beliefs in today’s America. Religion, guns, abortion, health care, parental leave, gerrymandering, election rules, and a whole lot more are issues that I’m totally out of synch with in America.

But I also recognize that the Constitution hamstrings you and that the mindset of the people dictates that the far left’s beliefs are non-starters. Sadly, I believe that incremental change is the most viable option. To believe otherwise is a fantasy.

[kop205]

4 hours ago, Redwire said:

Wow

On so many levels it is one of the worst posts I've ever read

[smithdown]

4 hours ago, New York Red said:

For the hundredth time, pretty much yes. I don’t disagree with much with her. In fact, I have a number of what would be labeled as radical beliefs in today’s America. Religion, guns, abortion, health care, parental leave, gerrymandering, election rules, and a whole lot more are issues that I’m totally out of synch with in America.

But I also recognize that the Constitution hamstrings you and that the mindset of the people dictates that the far left’s beliefs are non-starters. Sadly, I believe that incremental change is the most viable option. To believe otherwise is a fantasy.

You really should keep silent about those beliefs of yours in case someone hears you and finds  you to be unacceptable 

 

Your mere presence makes people vote republican, just your face and the way you dress is enough for normal rational people to buy a MAGA hat and a gun so the best thing you can do is stay in the house and wait til a centrist gives you the signal that it’s okay to come outside and say how you feel

[Nebraska Red]

7 hours ago, kop205 said:

On so many levels it is one of the worst posts I've ever read

In what way? Unless you live here, and interact, it is hard to see just how bitter and twisted people on the right are when it comes to progressive politics from the left.

It's much better, in their view, that the current systems stay in place.

 

Edited November 7, 2021 by Nebraska Red

[pipnasty]

The biggest achievement of capitalism is that it has managed to convince people that there is absolutely no alternative to it even as it falls apart around us. It is a collective lack of imagination that is the problem. 

[smithdown]

17 minutes ago, Nebraska Red said:

In what way? Unless you live here, and interact, it is hard to see just how bitter and twisted people on the right are when it comes to progressive politics from the left.

It's much better, in their view, that the current systems stay in place.

 

do you stay silent or are you allowed to speak your mind?

2 minutes ago, pipnasty said:

The biggest achievement of capitalism is that it has managed to convince people that there is absolutely no alternative to it even as it falls apart around us. It is a collective lack of imagination that is the problem. 

Biggest problem with it is the privileged telling the marginalised when they’re allowed to speak, which will be appropriate at some stage after I’ve made my last mortgage payment if you don’t mind 

[Nebraska Red]

4 minutes ago, smithdown said:

do you stay silent or are you allowed to speak your mind?

Biggest problem with it is the privileged telling the marginalised when they’re allowed to speak, which will be appropriate at some stage after I’ve made my last mortgage payment if you don’t mind 

I speak my mind in the appropriate situations. At our monthly Democratic meetings, these things are talked about openly, and,  for the most part, realistically. Given the state I live in, there is little chance of getting any progressive ideas out to anyone who is not a Democrat. It's very hard to keep some of the younger Democrats engaged as they get utterly frustrated with the lack of progress towards a more equitable form of Government in the USA.

Re your second paragraph, my biggest problem is with the fact that those with money are so determined to ensure that those that don't, shouldn't, and, never will have the chance of a better standard of living. I am not talking super rich either, just regular people who are comfortably off, but don't think the less well off should get access to some basic human decencies.

[smithdown]

9 minutes ago, Nebraska Red said:

I speak my mind in the appropriate situations. At our monthly Democratic meetings, these things are talked about openly, and,  for the most part, realistically. Given the state I live in, there is little chance of getting any progressive ideas out to anyone who is not a Democrat. It's very hard to keep some of the younger Democrats engaged as they get utterly frustrated with the lack of progress towards a more equitable form of Government in the USA.

Re your second paragraph, my biggest problem is with the fact that those with money are so determined to ensure that those that don't, shouldn't, and, never will have the chance of a better standard of living. I am not talking super rich either, just regular people who are comfortably off, but don't think the less well off should get access to some basic human decencies.

Neither Ilhan Omar or AOC live in Nebraska so I’ve no idea why they should change who they are to suit your neighbours, and I’m sure you don’t think they should either.  You’d probably encourage them to say what they want wherever they want to say it.  Being progressive n all.

[Nebraska Red]

11 minutes ago, smithdown said:

Neither Ilhan Omar or AOC live in Nebraska so I’ve no idea why they should change who they are to suit your neighbours, and I’m sure you don’t think they should either.  You’d probably encourage them to say what they want wherever they want to say it.  Being progressive n all.

I'm living in Florida now.

And no, I would not expect them to change to suit the beliefs or desires of my neighbors. 

However, when they don't support legislation, that is good for the country, because their requirements have not been included, it weakens the current administration and gives more ammunition to the Republican movement.

It frustrates the f*** out of me to see so many great ideas fall to the wayside, but the reality is that they will never happen, unless the Democrats manage to get an unassailable majority in both Congress and the Senate. t***s like Manchin and Sinema currently have too much sway in a 50/50 Senate. 

 

[smithdown]

Aaaah so it’s as Ilhan Omar said in the original tweet - it’s the centrist corporate carpet baggers who need to shut up and or get harassed out of office for handing power to to republicans and it isn’t her who is letting progressive causes down after all

 

This is well better than where the previous posts wanted us to go which was like the opposite of that in a way

Let’s dance 

 

 

[New York Red]

10 hours ago, kop205 said:

On so many levels it is one of the worst posts I've ever read

What a surprise. 

7 hours ago, smithdown said:

You really should keep silent about those beliefs of yours in case someone hears you and finds  you to be unacceptable 

 

Your mere presence makes people vote republican, just your face and the way you dress is enough for normal rational people to buy a MAGA hat and a gun so the best thing you can do is stay in the house and wait til a centrist gives you the signal that it’s okay to come outside and say how you feel

Thanks for the advice, but I’ll be as mouthy as I always am. 

[smithdown]

19 minutes ago, New York Red said:

What a surprise. 

Thanks for the advice, but I’ll be as mouthy as I always am. 

But someone might hear you!!!!  And every time they do that’s another Trump supporter created 

[pipnasty]

On 06/11/2021 at 04:49, New York Red said:

Ummmm, no you don’t. What she and Ilhan can do is to embrace less controversial positions rather than ones that have no chance of becoming law and which get used by the right to boost their campaigns.

The present situation sucks. The voters who look and sound like her have gotten the shaft repeatedly. But championing views that have no chance of happening is pointless. It sucks, but it is pointless.

 

Lot's of things are impossible until they actually happen - the dismantling of apartheid in South Africa, women's right to vote and the abolition of slavery were all things that had no chance of happening. Going to the moon was impossible, yet we did it. Maybe the people involved in each of these struggles should have embraced less controversial positions and gone quietly to their graves, defeated by the need to play it safe at all times. And now we face the greatest challenge that humanity has ever faced and we need the visionaries more than ever - even if it is only to say that we gave it our best shot. We need more Klopps and less Hodgsons and your post sounds more like the latter than the former and that is a real shame.

Edited November 7, 2021 by pipnasty

[kop205]

4 hours ago, Nebraska Red said:

In what way? Unless you live here, and interact, it is hard to see just how bitter and twisted people on the right are when it comes to progressive politics from the left.

It's much better, in their view, that the current systems stay in place.

 

Mostly cos of what pip said but also because it completely overlooked the fact that the likes of AOC will get slaughtered by some for any non-right-wing position she takes simply by dint of her being a black woman.

It isn't those of the self-confessed right who don't want systematic change.

 

3 hours ago, Nebraska Red said:

It's very hard to keep some of the younger Democrats engaged as they get utterly frustrated with the lack of progress towards a more equitable form of Government in the USA.

I don't think the way to re-engage them is to tell the likes of AOC to be more like an old, rich, white guy.

[Nebraska Red]

1 minute ago, kop205 said:

Mostly cos of what pip said but also because it completely overlooked the fact that the likes of AOC will get slaughtered by some for any non-right-wing position she takes simply by dint of her being a black woman.

It isn't those of the self-confessed right who don't want systematic change.

 

I presume you meant to say "it isn't just...

And you are right on both counts. She is discounted and villified by reason of her color. There are also large numbers of Democrats who don't want to see any wholesale and effective systematic change. All, except Manchin and Sinema are mostly silent in their objections.

[Hassony]

On 05/11/2021 at 07:39, smithdown said:

Having a go at AOC now

Harsh, He was our best midfielder today 

[Nebraska Red]

1 hour ago, Hassony said:

Harsh, He was our best midfielder today 

He  was utter rubbish IMHO.

[Gethin]

Speaking of AOC, this is f***ing vile

 

[smithdown]

3 hours ago, Gethin said:

Speaking of AOC, this is f***ing vile

 

We are in the madhouse when she is the problem but that’s the next stage apparently - can see it here with the arms fair v mayor debacle too 

 

[kop205]

5 minutes ago, smithdown said:

We are in the madhouse when she is the problem but that’s the next stage apparently - can see it here with the arms fair v mayor debacle too 

 

She just needs to adopt more sensible views, then she'll be safe.

[D.Boon]

Genuinely shocking stuff.

[New York Red]

10 hours ago, kop205 said:

She just needs to adopt more sensible views, then she'll be safe.

That’s not the answer as you well know.
 

The answer is to put up candidates who can beat these evil and psychotic members of Congress like Gosar, Green, Jordan, Gohmert, Cawthorn. But easier than that is to put moderate Democrats in who can beat the likes of McCarthy, Nunes, Zeldin, and any other vulnerable Republicans, be it because of their constituency or their behavior.