The diving debate

[Igors Uncle Dave]

More and more names are being thrown into the mill including the likes of Stevie and Nando. Any true red would say they have seen it, but where do you stand on the debate? Should we clear the game once and for all? Should we make sure that everyone plays on the same field or are we going to continue to turn a blind eye?

 

Thoughts?

[Mike]

nice pun

[AE]

Well I would play Tom Daley just to the left of Torres and that should resolve all issues.

[Kvarme Ate My Food]

being discussed here

 

But if we're having another thread, I'll just say I think the issue is overrated. I just don't care that much about it. If the ref spots it, you get punished - that's it as far as I'm concerned.

[DanielS]

Its this year's "current climate". It exists and it'll always exist. Nearly every player does it - no club can pretend they have a diver free squad. The whole furore is pointless.

[Igors Uncle Dave]

Ah - sorry!!!

[CarraLegend]

I want our players to be good at it and gain an advantage, any player who does it against us I want dead there and then.

[Chili Palmer]

More and more names are being thrown into the mill including the likes of Stevie and Nando. Any true red would say they have seen it, but where do you stand on the debate? Should we clear the game once and for all? Should we make sure that everyone plays on the same field or are we going to continue to turn a blind eye?

 

Thoughts?

 

 

It usually works better that way.

 

 

As for the diving, I don't want our lads to stop doing it until We stop getting it done against us, if that makes sense. Obviously I would rather we didn't have to.

[Real Madred]

Listening to Alvin Martin on Talksport yesterday who said he couldn't name one player who is 100% honest. I have to agree. If a player can gain an advantage he will and I'm sure some managers encorage it.

 

Also I think referees have some effect. If a player doesn't get an obvious decision in his favour he will take advantage of less clear decisions to con the referee.

[BG]

I really loathe it. Personally I've thought for a while that penalties given in top level games should be reviewed for diving and if the diving is clear then the player should get a ban - basically as Eduardo did. That would effectively end diving in the box.

 

On a related note I think players being treated unnecessarily (think Drogba) in order to slow down and break up the game is another issue. IMHO if the game is stopped to treat a player the player should be made to go off the pitch for 2 minutes.

[Benzo-13]

Hate it but what makes it worse as a current debate is the likes of Slur, Wenger and Rooney putting their own slanted view on it which is usually hypocrisy and unquestioned lies.

 

If its going to be ethically clamped down on there has to be collective responsibility.

[John am Rhein]

More and more names are being thrown into the mill including the likes of Stevie and Nando. Any true red would say they have seen it, but where do you stand on the debate? Should we clear the game once and for all? Should we make sure that everyone plays on the same field or are we going to continue to turn a blind eye?

 

Thoughts?

 

Liverpool players should win by any means necessary

[Knox_Harrington]

Liverpool players should win by any means necessary

That'll do.

[Logic]

I really loathe it. Personally I've thought for a while that penalties given in top level games should be reviewed for diving and if the diving is clear then the player should get a ban - basically as Eduardo did. That would effectively end diving in the box.

 

On a related note I think players being treated unnecessarily (think Drogba) in order to slow down and break up the game is another issue. IMHO if the game is stopped to treat a player the player should be made to go off the pitch for 2 minutes.

Or they should do as they did several years ago in the WC or the EC (can't remember which), get the paramedics in and get the player off the field at once. They can receive treatment off the field for as long as they want to.

[Rory Fitzgerald]

I dont have an issue with players ensuring that they get a decision when they see things coming e.g.

 

Park's* pen against us last season and Gerrard's** pen in the same game. Both were avoidable by each player but when Reina and Evra make the wrong decision, then why should the opposition let you off the hook ?

 

I am 100% against the cases where players simulate contact and fall over i.e. those times where there are no contact whatsoever like the way Henrik Larsson dived against us in the UEFA Cup in and won the pen for Celtic to go 2-1 up. That was a dive about 1 or 2 yards away from James's hand.

 

I also dont like the situations where contact is made and players drop to the ground. This is not like the Park/Gerrard pens above, the were the result of late and silly challenges but rather in the situations where the contact is the contact that is made as part of the game, body to body, side to side and then the player drops as though he has been smashed.

 

 

* Park only had to enure he touched the ball first, he knew Reina was going to make contact. He didnt care where the ball went and didnt attempt to jump - but why should he ?

 

**Gerrard touched the ball out off his feet nicely from Torres's pass, he did this with his left foot. Evra made the challenge and contact was made with Gerrard's left foot which was on the ground, but when you run natuarlly, Gerrard's right foot should have been in the air i.e. in stride so that he 'could have' skipped over the challenge - but when you see it, his right foot stays dead straight meaning that it also makes contact with Evra and whilst his feet are stuck on the ground his body is still in a go-forward-motion and is off balance and has to fall forward with no supporting foot underneath. I think Gerrard did the same to Gary Neville in 2004 when Murphy scored that pen. Its very clever and I dont have a problem with it, why should he let the opposition off with a challenge that doesnt win the ball ?

Edited September 5, 2009 by Rory Fitzgerald

[Coyler]

Or they should do as they did several years ago in the WC or the EC (can't remember which), get the paramedics in and get the player off the field at once. They can receive treatment off the field for as long as they want to.

This is the source of the current rule requiring fakers to leave the pitch for 'treatment', continuing the game in their absence and thereby negating to some extent any advantage accruing from the inital halt, which is a good thing (cf. Liverpool v Olympiakos, 2005). The ostentatious scoffing of the bravado pundits has glossed the f*** over that, though.

[_00_deathscar]

If we're entering a diving debate, isn't it preferable not to stand?

Edited September 5, 2009 by _00_deathscar

[BG]

I dont have an issue with players ensuring that they get a decision when they see things coming e.g.

 

I agree that this is a worthwhile distinction.

[cymrococh]

I want our players to be good at it and gain an advantage, any player who does it against us I want dead there and then.

The only answer.

 

We should be participating in more gamesmanship, we're too honest for a big club.

[Logic]

This is the source of the current rule requiring fakers to leave the pitch for 'treatment', continuing the game in their absence and thereby negating to some extent any advantage accruing from the inital halt, which is a good thing (cf. Liverpool v Olympiakos, 2005). The ostentatious scoffing of the bravado pundits has glossed the f*** over that, though.

Yup, but at the moment all the "treatment" happens on the pitch and then they have to leave the pitch to come back on. Which is idiotic.

 

Players simply shouldn't be allowed treatment on the pitch (unless they are obviously seriously injured). Simple as that.

[Rory Fitzgerald]

I hate that rule though Coyler, the first time I noticed it was the game at OT in 2004 in which Murphy's winner was the penalty.

 

The incident was in the first half and Liverpool won a free kick in an advanced position when Kewell was fouled. He was taken off the pitch but because the ref was talking to a Utd player (not sure if he booked him), by the time the game was ready to re-start with the free, Kewell wanted to come back on but the ref wouldnt let him.

 

Thats when it struck me, Utd committed a foul and we get penalised by not being allowed have 11 players on the pitch for the free kick ?????

[smithdown]

There's one at Wembley there. A Man Utd player won it.

[Smith]

It's really, really horrible and should be dealt with. Divers should be punished/banned by the use of video reviews, conducted by the FA/FIFA/UEFA/ etc.

Edited September 5, 2009 by Smith

[Pam]

I hope given the new crackdown Rooney will accept his 2 game ban gracefully for that outrageous piece of simulation for england vs Slovenia to cheat his way to that penalty

[Rory Fitzgerald]

Not watching the England game - PLEASE tell me it was a real dive after the speel he gave to the media this week.