Ed the Wool

Fixed it for you.

There's always that chance, but in this market, with the size of the loan and the common knowledge that the pair of them are leveraged to the eyeballs all over the place? I'm not sure anyone would take a punt on it. Furthermore, even if they managed it at a much higher interest rate, the club as it is couldn't afford to keep up with the repayments. So they'd have to sell the best players, which in turn would make the value of the club plummet, which would make the chances of gettign a stadium built and Hicks making the money he wants impossible. I think they've got to sell. I think they realise that, and all the 'we want 600m' is just piss and wind.

I've suspected this is what might be happening since about last September, but I hope the Sheik sits tight, has spoken to RBS about a price, and takes the pair of c**k suckers to the cleaners. That'd be what they deserve. Hicks can swagger all he wants, but he's royally f***ed. And I hope RBS squeeze them personally once they default. The only thing that will make things happen before July is if Hicks realises the game is up and he stands to lose big. He appears arrogant and greedy enough to self destruct over this though.

Where are you getting the 'probably will result in a period of administration'. There's no need. They can't repay the loan, the bank reposeses the club and goes after the former owners for as much as possible. No need for administration. Why would it be in the banks interest to do that, causing docked points, which would drive the price of their asset down further? Still, given you clearly have experience in the world of investment banking debt refinance, it probably isn't an insight to you, but it might be to some others on here.

Fits in with a discussion I had today. I had a word with one of the lawyers today who deals specifically with debt transactions. What he said was interesting. 1. Banks (like RBS) in the current climate are aggressively targeting borrowers who are at risk of defaulting. 2. Where the borrowers have an asset, the banks would rather have that asset sold to a third party than take control of it when the loan expires. The reason for this is once a loan expires, if they have to take control of the asset, it is almost always then worth LESS than the amount of the loan (and they have the ballache of dealing with it. 3. So if H&G sell to a 3rd party before July they should be able to pay the debt back in full to RBS/Wachovia. If they don't they'll stand to lose whatever they put up as collateral, adn RBS Wachovia will be stuck with an asset they don't want. Therefore it'll be a buyers market, RBS will want to shift it as fast as possible and they may well not end up getting full market value. The long and short of it is RBS/Wachovia have got H&G' balls in a vice. Unless they sell before July, they stand to lose the club and the chance of making any profit whatsoever. To what is interesting about the last 24 hours is whether Dubai have given the nod that they are no longer interested. The new interested party must know if Dubai are out of the running, they only need to let the clock tick down to July, and the price will continue to come down. Finally, H&G defaulting and RBS/Wachovia taking temporary control will not result in administration, simply a change of ownership. Presumeably followed by another change of ownership as the banks sell it on to the highest bidder.

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Aye fair enough. We both want the same thing after all. Another thing about the thread though, the 'we draw too much'. We've drawn two more than Utd (who have lost one more than us) and one more than Chelsea.

The Liverpool way to me includes all of the above. You are just making excuses for yourself coming ok here and repeating 'we're doomed' when it's quite clear we are nothing of the sort. You're entitled to your opinion, entitled to support the team how you want. I get it. It's my opinion your negativity and lack of faith are both disappointing, and at this stage lacking in rationale.

Forgive me, but having a bit of faith and sticking it out to the end isn't 'super fan'-dom. It's the base level. To me personally the reason Istanbul was the greatest night of my life was because it was mythic, that no matter what the odds, how down and beaten and kicked to the kerb you feel, there's always a chance. If you dig in and do you your best and believe there's always a chance. I thought that is what being a football fan is all about? Its got nothing to do with being a 'super fan'. And to compare Istanbul to the current title race, we've barely kicked off yet, there's no rock bottom in sight yet. Which is why I'm scrathcing my head at some of the posts on here.

That's more like it. I can't believe there are people rolling over now. Probably the types who turned the tv off at half time in Istanbul, or went home from the pub. What the f***. Not the first clue about what supporting your team or the liverpool way is all about. This Utd team is scraping results and they have to play us. You think they'll be looking forward to that? Chelsea are stuttering. There's not one team in this division we can't beat. 1. Get a grip. 2. Grow some balls 3. If you can't manage 1&2 have a word with yourself.

Ok you win the pedant award. You know what I meant.

You might as well stop watching and posting now then. Is it f*** over. Its about desire and winning games now, the first we have plenty of, the second we are well capable of. It'll go all the way this one. I'll believe we will do it until it's mathematically impossible.

Awesome. Makes your chest fill with pride and your heart fill with hope. In a week of 100m offers for Kaka, he understands what football should really be about. It's hard to read that and think destiny isn't calling the kind of success he is focused on.

well, according to the Telegraph - Rafa has let Ferguson get under his skin. There are 2 ways to read this: Complete bull Exlax gets under everyone's skin. I don't think they mean this though they reckon Rafa's body language tells it's own story Dr Karl Morris, a leading sports psychologist who has worked with Andrew Flintoff, examines the five key areas of Rafael Benitez’s broadside. QUOTE THE NOTES The fact that Benitez has got chapter and verse written down shows that he is so wound up that he is determined to get everything off his chest. Sir Alex’s remarks have been festering and he is determined not to forget to say anything in the heat of the moment. THE VOICE Benitez starts off speaking very calmly, quite measured, but it’s almost too calm. The effort of it makes the delivery a little forced, and he can’t keep the façade up. RISING TO THE BAIT Many of the claims Sir Alex makes are for the benefit of his own team, but he’s so good at getting his rivals to the stage where they just can’t keep their feelings bottled up. He will be delighted Benitez has reacted. MIND GAMES Sir Alex knows what he’s doing when he makes these comments, but Benitez’s reaction is not one of a man confident his side can win the title. He is trying to control what is outside his sphere of influence. It’s a cliché in psychology but you should only worry about what you can control, not what you can’t. That Benitez is trying to influence things beyond his control suggests Sir Alex has rattled him. What a giant pile of s****. Doctorate in limpdicked bulls*** more like. Written down so he could nail it fact by fact. Written it down because English is his second language. Written it down so there's no argument, no deviation from exactly the point he wants to make, and some c*** in the press or the FA can say he's 'bringing the game into disrepute'. They might try that anyway, nothing would surprise me. I can't be arsed to deal with the other points. Total rubbish.

Exactly. He's played a f***ing blinder. I don't need some slackjawed genetic throwback on Fleet Street to to tell me that. Ferguson 'amused' my a***. I bet he's spitting with rage.

Dalglish by some considerable margin. Then Stevie Nicol as he's just what we need for the run in. Then Barnes. If it wasn't for Torres, I might have said Rush first though.

Exactly what I said. Pretty much kicked him out of the room in disgust.

I lost my s*** with an Arsenal fan a couple of weeks back who couldn't see how great Sami was. 'Would he get in the defence of a top four side'? he asked in that typically smug Arsenal way. He might get in theirs now they are fifth. I read someone say recently he'd not far off our best ever centre back. He's been an awesome presence in our team since arriving.

Good result, could have been a slippery one. Agree with he posts re Babel, really think he's not going to fulfill his potential as a right winger. Can't seeing him having a future with us past the summer. It's a damn shame as I think he has it all except for attitude and application.

Owen to Inter I heard today.

Agreed, its idle speculation without the facts. Can't see the first blow being an elbow though, that's some kung-fu sheeeet if it was! I suspect they've slapped the affray on due to there being other incidents:- "Where two or more persons use or threaten the unlawful violence, it is the conduct of them taken together that must be considered for the purpose of subsection (1)" but again proving that is going to be difficult unless there is security camera footage. Hope like Molby says, it gets dropped.

Would add that from what I can remember the 'self defence' defence allows 'reasonable force. If stevie thought he was going to be attacked, that leave a fair bit available.

If he shoved Stevie first, then it would be very easy to claim anything stevie did (within reason) was self defence. Especially if over the mic comments had already been insulting, he would have every reason to believe the guy was hostile. Hopefully he's innocent in this and will get cleared.

God almighty. Complete rubbish. Don't know where to start. Nothing to see here.

Excellent post. Amen.