What should an owners contribution be?

[New York Red]

We all talk about our owners and how f*cking horrible they are, but what do you think would be the right owner for Liverpool?

 

The thought of having bucketloads of cash like Chelsea or Man City doesn;t appeal to some. The hands-off, heavily leveraged ownership at Manchester United doesn;t seem as bad as it initially did. The patient, well funded and structured ownership like at Arsenal might appeal to others.

 

Think about budgets in particular. Our income is comprised of:

 

Home game revenue

Away game participation revenue (do we still get that)

Premier League money

Champions League money

Merchandising

Owners contributions

 

Our expenditures (to cut a long story short) are:

 

Operations

Wages

Transfer money

 

The highlighted items are the ones which are the most unpredictable. What do you think they should be? One side needs to equal the other, but in particular, the transfer money and the owners wedge seem to be a black hole.

 

Is it inappropriate for an owner to put any money in at all?

Is it appropriate for an owner to be expected to pay for any shortfall, regardless of what it is?

[Sion]

They shouldn't and don't have to contribute anything towards transfer budgets. They just have to run the club in such a way that the transfer budget is what it should be and funds aren't diverted off to pay needless debt. They're currently not even close.

[richwilks]

They shouldn't and don't have to contribute anything towards transfer budgets. They just have to run the club in such a way that the transfer budget is what it should be and funds aren't diverted off to pay needless debt. They're currently not even close.

 

 

Yeah, if they are paying £35 million a year off their debt then that is the transfer fund right there, they don't need to put money in.

[New York Red]

So a debt issue? Man Utd model isn't good for us?

[honourablegeorge]

If the owners appeared in neither column, that'd be ideal

 

As it is, they're taking money from the transfers, and putting it in their loans, and expenses, anf who knows what else. They're nothing but a burden. Two burdens. Two fat burdens.

Edited November 25, 2009 by honourablegeorge

[Bailo]

So a debt issue? Man Utd model isn't good for us?

Depends. They could be on the way to a situation like us - where has the Ronaldo money gone?

[anfield11]

Depends. They could be on the way to a situation like us - where has the Ronaldo money gone?

 

 

 

Was just going to add that.

 

Isn't it odd that they don't have the press and ex managers [like Souness] saying they had to sell Ronaldo to keep afloat?!

[Dominus Maximus]

It's like people don't understand how the owners a withdrawing money from the club, and the club doesn't really get anything in return. How hard is it too understand. It's like being robbed, but whilst you are watching the thieves sitting in your chair and eating your dinner.

Edited November 25, 2009 by Jallow

[Jarg Armani]

Less lies.

More cash. Bucketloads would be fine by me.

 

Seems like it's the same people who say "Liverpool FC exists to win things" who also regard that level of investment as not part of the Liverpool Way.

[Rimbeux]

Put the right people in charge of the business and the football and stay the hell out of it, both income and expenses and outgoings, until such time as either of the two in charge f*** up. They can make their money if and when they sell up

[New York Red]

Was just going to add that.

 

Isn't it odd that they don't have the press and ex managers [like Souness] saying they had to sell Ronaldo to keep afloat?!

 

That was a serious lump of cash that wasn't spent on players.

[Rimbeux]

That was a serious lump of cash that wasn't spent on players.

 

 

They could actually do with it as well if you look critically, but they're still collectively very strong and used to winning and overcoming whatever it takes it seems

[New York Red]

Does anyone have any idea of the line items in this admittedly simply budget?

 

Wage bill?

Prem income?

UEFA income?

Annual endorsements?

[Rimbeux]

Does anyone have any idea of the line items in this admittedly simply budget?

 

Wage bill? £90-£100m

Prem income? £30m-£50M

UEFA income? £20M+, up to £40M

Annual endorsements? £20?

 

 

Top of my head. You also need to add in gates around £30m?

[surf]

Yeah, if they are paying £35 million a year off their debt then that is the transfer fund right there, they don't need to put money in.

 

thats about right. we used to make a small profit after spending £15m-£20m on players. now we just pay interest and dont bother with buying players

[surf]

Does anyone have any idea of the line items in this admittedly simply budget?

 

Wage bill? 70m

Prem income? 30m

UEFA income? 20m (2006) 30m (2005)

Annual endorsements? ??

 

check this out

 

http://www.liverpoolfc.tv/club/LFC_R&A06.pdf

[surf]

those accounts show we're in debt to the tune of 25m, that needs to be repaid.

 

under G&H we're paying a similar amount annually just in interest

[Rimbeux]

those accounts show we're in debt to the tune of 25m, that needs to be repaid.

 

under G&H we're paying a similar amount annually just in interest

 

 

They are three years old though, pre takeover

[surf]

They are three years old though, pre takeover

 

Yeah, i was comparing LFC under Moores and LFC under G&H.

 

Our total debt level just before G&H took over was 'only' 25m. It's at least 10-fold now and we're paying (i guess) about 25m a year just in interest. Goes to show just how bad our plight is under these clowns and why there's no money for transfers.

 

Our income structure is still the same, our expenses have increased due to interest payments, the result is the 15m-20m we had a year to spend on players is now spent on repaying a loan.

 

If anyone needs reminding why the yanks are killing the club this is it.

[New York Red]

I would guess that an owner who didn;t want to incur any debt would be the best situation of all. Huge wads of cash would not be needed to make things very different.

 

Take the most conservative approach of all.

 

First team wages: 80 (5% increase per annum since 2007)

Administration Wages: 10 (150% of Rafa's)

Stadium Operations: 7 (about a quarter million per game)

Academy: 5

Administration costs: 10 (guess)

Transfer Expenditures: 20 (the promise)

 

That is 132 million total.

 

 

Games revenues: 30 (since 25 in 2006)

Premier league TV revenue 29 (4th place)

Premier League prize money 13 (4th palce)

Champions League money 20 (round of 16)

Merchandising 19 (since having 16 in 2006)

Standard Charter deal: 20 (2010-2014)

Adidad shirt deal: 10 (130 over 11 years)

Additinal sponsors: 10 (ten at a million each -- thats a guess)

 

That's 150 million without the owners chipping in anything.

 

Now I am missing income from investments etc. But, we still would appear to be oretty damn flush with money. The sheet looks pretty good. With an owner not carrying debt, we could easily finance a new stadium. As it is we are leveraged to the hilt and our future is completely held in these charlatan's hands.

[Flasher]

Correct