We Have to Put Rafa Behind Us

[Flight]

It's probably true that a significant part in the sacking of Rafa was to enable G&H to meet less resistance from the manager in their ownership of the club.

 

However, we can't prove that. Rafa is gone and, whether we like it or not, his sacking can be justified.

 

 

Referring in any way to Rafa being sacked as part of any protest risks undermining opposition to G&H and splitting the fans.

 

Protests have to concentrate on the financial state of the club and the continued lies and deceit of the owners. We must demand from the club that any money brought in from player sales are reinvested in the squad.

[Flasher]

I think Rafa should be the new chairman of SOS

[The Hitman]

Imagine chants at Anfield for Rafa next season?

[Gomez]

Imagine chants at Anfield for Rafa next season?

 

At this point in time, I can't imagine that not happening.

[Flasher]

Imagine chants at Anfield for Rafa next season?

 

I am sure there will be, if for no other reason than the man made us great in Europe again. And got Torres to sign for us.

[Widnesian]

Unless the new manager has a complete mare and loses the first 5 games, I don't think there will be. How would he feel hearing his predecessors name being chanted? I would hope that the new manager and team has the crowd behind them next season and gets the support they deserve. At the end of the day, Rafa's done all right for himself, he's moved on and we need to move on accordingly.

[Gomez]

Unless the new manager has a complete mare and loses the first 5 games, I don't think there will be. How would he feel hearing his predecessors name being chanted? I would hope that the new manager and team has the crowd behind them next season and gets the support they deserve. At the end of the day, Rafa's done all right for himself, he's moved on and we need to move on accordingly.

 

You can hope all you like, if the new manager is one of the mediocre names being mentioned in the press, then half the fanbase at least will consider him a stooge and a puppet. Specially if Gerrard and / or Torres have gone.

[Widnesian]

You can hope all you like, if the new manager is one of the mediocre names being mentioned in the press, then half the fanbase at least will consider him a stooge and a puppet. Specially if Gerrard and / or Torres have gone.

You're a real ray of sunshine on here aren't you.

[Sir Tokyo Sexwale]

Nah - whoever the new manager is, we have to get behind him. Doesn't mean we have to dilute our hatred for the owners though. The way they dealt with getting rid of Rafa stinks too

[Ramón Benítez Hernández]

You're a real ray of sunshine on here aren't you.

 

 

And Bob's your uncle.

[Hassony]

Nah - whoever the new manager is, we have to get behind him. Doesn't mean we have to dilute our hatred for the owners though. The way they dealt with getting rid of Rafa stinks too

 

unless it's Hughes

[Gomez]

You're a real ray of sunshine on here aren't you.

 

I'm trying to be pragmatic.

 

Yeah, in an ideal world we should get behind the new man, but this isn't an ideal world and there is a very strong case the new man will be selected to just 'coach and train the team' rather than buy, sell, plan, build and win trophies.

 

Just looking at the forum and speaking to my Liverpool supporting friends and family members, it is clear the fanbase is far from united. It's all very well saying you should support your club, but that presupposes people still feel this is their club, and those that don't want their club back, There are a lot of people who would happily take administration and all that goes with it to get rid of these two assclowns.

 

To expect instant unity in the stadium just because someone has been appointed, regardless of who it is, is naive.

 

Edit:

Regardless of any of that, his is name is going to get sung anyway.

 

It is not disrespectful of any new manager to sing the name of best manager we have had in the last 20 years who was treated shabbily by the club.

 

His name will be sung for the first few matches and whenever he turns up in the stands. I guess it's unlikely he'll be in the opposing dugout for a while (and being an TV analyst isn't really his style)

Edited June 7, 2010 by Gomez

[Pam]

should we just put Torres/Gerrard/Mascherano behind us too when our parastic owners sell them to service their debt?

 

i will always support the team but at the moment i don't feel very inclined to support the club hierarchy behind the team (or what will be left of the team come August!)

 

if we don't replace Rafa with someone at least as good and if not better and then back him in the transfer market then we are in real trouble. i don't see how you can seperate the outrageous way Rafa has been treated with the way the "custodians" of our club are stomping all over our credibility. we are a laughing stock and are in danger of a Leeds/Newcastle-esque plummet into mid table (or worse) hell

[David Hodgson]

It's probably true that a significant part in the sacking of Rafa was to enable G&H to meet less resistance from the manager in their ownership of the club.

 

However, we can't prove that. Rafa is gone and, whether we like it or not, his sacking can be justified.

 

 

Referring in any way to Rafa being sacked as part of any protest risks undermining opposition to G&H and splitting the fans.

 

Protests have to concentrate on the financial state of the club and the continued lies and deceit of the owners. We must demand from the club that any money brought in from player sales are reinvested in the squad.

 

Good post.

[Lee W]

However, we can't prove that. Rafa is gone and, whether we like it or not, his sacking can be justified.

 

Based on last season..... maybe.

 

Based on the best interests of the club, on and off the pitch moving forward......definitely not.

[Knox_Harrington]

Totally disagree, Flight. One of the key criticisms of these clowns is the way they've aggressively undermined the office of the manager repeatedly, ending in what happened last Wednesday night. In fact, that they don't really understand that office and what it is meant to do. This needs saying again and again.

[David Hodgson]

Totally disagree, Flight. One of the key criticisms of these clowns is the way they've aggressively undermined the office of the manager repeatedly, ending in what happened last Wednesday night. In fact, that they don't really understand that office and what it is meant to do. This needs saying again and again.

 

I disagree. They've got on badly with Rafa is what they've done. Pure and simple. He's undermined them, they've undermined him. He's more correct in is his undermining than they are, but there were no innocents in that relationship.

 

What they did last week was draw a veil over a messy partnership. Ideally (by a mile) it would be them going first, but they and Rafa had to split for the good of the club. You could argue that they should have ultimately kowtowed to him, and come to heal, but I think it was too late for that. Something had to give to at least give us a chance of progression (if only in the short term). If we have to have Hicks and Gillette (and we do have to in the short run) then it has to be with a manager they can work with.

[Jarg Armani]

I disagree. They've got on badly with Rafa is what they've done. Pure and simple. He's undermined them, they've undermined him. He's more correct in is his undermining than they are, but there were no innocents in that relationship.

 

What they did last week was draw a veil over a messy partnership. Ideally (by a mile) it would be them going first, but they and Rafa had to split for the good of the club. You could argue that they should have ultimately kowtowed to him, and come to heal, but I think it was too late for that. Something had to give to at least give us a chance of progression (if only in the short term). If we have to have Hicks and Gillette (and we do have to in the short run) then it has to be with a manager they can work with.

 

This is wrong. You're taking the attitude we've been lumbered with post Rafa and applied it to when he was still here.

 

The situation has changed by huge degrees, now it would be better if we can find a manager they can tell the truth to, but that doesn't excuse them from being the party at fault for the lies and shifting sands while the last manager was here.

[KIDORIGINAL]

Rafa Benítez made us great again. In twelve months he dragged our club back to the top of Europe and it was all going nicely until Hicks and Gillett turned up; the symmetry of their arrival and our trophy drought cannot be ignored when looking back on Rafa's reign here. The hypocrisy used by so many people when attacking him drew us closer to him whether we thought him a great manager or not and that's not something we can put behind us, just like that. Rafa deserves his place with Shankley, Fagan and Paisley, we don't forget about them.

[David Hodgson]

This is wrong. You're taking the attitude we've been lumbered with post Rafa and applied it to when he was still here.

 

The situation has changed by huge degrees, now it would be better if we can find a manager they can tell the truth to, but that doesn't excuse them from being the party at fault for the lies and shifting sands while the last manager was here.

 

I'm not wrong. I'm right.

 

I said before the sacking that we needed clarity. I wanted a managerial change, but I was prepared to back Rafa in the new H & G world order whereby all parties might be pulling together and make it work. Much as I wanted a managerial change I thought that harmony and common purpose was key. I valued that first and foremost (see that thread I started about a month ago about getting behind Rafa). It seemed at that time that G & H simply couldn't afford to sack Rafa, so if they were going to be stuck with him (and he with them) then I wanted them to try and work things out.

 

There's no doubting that G & H were hugely at fault during Rafa's tenure in their treatment of him, but that doesn't make him the right man for the job. What would people have said if we'd had a manager who'd continually stood up to G & H and stood for the soul of the club, but perenially made bad footballing decisions ? They'd have said 'sack him, I don't care if he represents the soul of the club, he's still a sh*t manager'. Now I know that simple situation didn't exist with Rafa, but that doesn't mean that whatever G & H did wrong we had to suspend critical facility where Rafa was concerned, and not consider his tenure relative to the team's achievements.

 

When it became clear that they could afford to sack Rafa, then I think it made sense from a footballing perspective, and also a working unity perspective. It's possible to reach that conclusion and still despise everything G & H stand for and wish they'd gone first.

[Jarg Armani]

When it became clear that they could afford to sack Rafa, then I think it made sense from a footballing perspective, and also a working unity perspective. It's possible to reach that conclusion and still despise everything G & H stand for and wish they'd gone first.

 

It doesn't make sense from a footballing perspective if we go downhill from here.

 

I agree that it makes sense from a working unity perspective, but only for a new man. I didn't want Benitez to fold and turn into Ferguson as you indicated in the get behind Rafa thread, because I think it had gone too far for there to be trust between them, and something had to give. I'm just absolutely gutted that the wrong thing gave, and the football club made it's wrongest ever decision.

[David Hodgson]

It doesn't make sense from a footballing perspective if we go downhill from here.

 

I agree that it makes sense from a working unity perspective, but only for a new man. I didn't want Benitez to fold and turn into Ferguson as you indicated in the get behind Rafa thread, because I think it had gone too far for there to be trust between them, and something had to give. I'm just absolutely gutted that the wrong thing gave, and the football club made it's wrongest ever decision.

 

I didn't say that it was proven that it was the right footballing decision (perhaps only time can prove that) I just said that it made sense i.e. there was a case for changing manager given the season we'd just had.

 

Relatively speaking I'd also far prefer that G & H had been the ones to give way (i.e. f*ck off) ahead of Rafa, but that was not likely to be a realistic option unless you believed that the take-over was going to happen any day soon.

[Jarg Armani]

I didn't say that it was proven that it was the right footballing decision (perhaps only time can prove that) I just said that it made sense i.e. there was a case for changing manager given the season we'd just had.

 

And you were told time and again that we wouldn't be getting someone better.

 

You thought otherwise.

 

Now you're not even coming out with wait and see, you know it's going to be someone worse and you're trying to find a) the bright side, and b) some alternative vindication of your p.o.v.

[David Hodgson]

And you were told time and again that we wouldn't be getting someone better.

 

You thought otherwise.

 

Now you're not even coming out with wait and see, you know it's going to be someone worse and you're trying to find a) the bright side, and b) some alternative vindication of your p.o.v.

 

I argued that a monkey would be better than someone on the sort of run Rafa was on. I'd lost faith in the manager entirely. Of course I knew it would be tough to get someone better than the Rafa of yesteryear, but I believed that the current model was easily replaced, and I still hold that view.

[Rocheteau]

Totally disagree, Flight. One of the key criticisms of these clowns is the way they've aggressively undermined the office of the manager repeatedly, ending in what happened last Wednesday night. In fact, that they don't really understand that office and what it is meant to do. This needs saying again and again.

 

They gave him a five year contract worth what, £4m a year, they got rid of Parry who was a pain in his a*** and they gave him the sort of control at Anfield that he'll never have again nor existed anywhere else as far as I know

 

 

Burn tar and feather them righteously for crippling the club with debt, for failing to build a stadium and for rudderless leadership, and dance on their graves - I'll join you, but one things Hicks was not guilty of and thats aggressively undermining Benitez,