Is Gerard a midfielder

[sean]

Interesting as I hear this ad nauseum from Giles re: Gerrard:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

For those of you who don't know him, or are too young to remember, John Giles was an Irish midfield player who played for a very successful Leeds team in the early seventies, as well as with Man Utd and Rep of Ireland, whom he also managed for a period.

 

Giles was a brilliant midfielder, one of the best of his generation. Hard, vicious at times, but he had finesse as well, and could see a pass. Most of all, he could boss a game, like Robson, Souness or Keane, just with his perception and footballing brain.

 

I came across a quote from Graeme Souness about Giles. Their careers overlapped by a few years and Souness tells the story of his first game playing against Giles. He says he went into a tackle on Giles, looking to really cement him and it was like tackling dust. Five minutes later, Souness went in for a ball, and came out of it with Giles' studs all down the back of one leg. As he looked up, Giles winked at him and said "you will learn". And Souness says he did.

 

What has this to do with Gerrard? Well, the last two times Liverpool have been on Irish tv, Giles (who does the studio pundit job, with Liam Brady and Eamon Dunphy) has been saying the same thing - Gerrard is not a midfielder.

 

Now, Giles makes no bones about the fact that Gerrard is a wonderful player (and Giles doesn't use the word "wonderful" a lot!). But he thinks Gerrard does great things from midfield, as against being a great midfielder. Giles is quite certain Gerrard doesn't have the ability, or more accurately, the inclination to be a proper midfielder. He doesn't knit things together (although he can), he doesn't cover his back four (again, he can), he doesn't set the tempo. He can do all these things, just as he can tackle and track back. He just doesn't, or at least not all the time.

 

Now, Giles comes from a time when "midfielder" meant central midfielder - those other guys were wingers. But you can see his point.

 

It's interesting to hear because Giles has no particular axe to grind. He's not a polemicist, like Dunphy, or a Gunner, like Brady. Also, as anyone who watches the Irish coverage knows, they aren't beholden to the money men, like Sky, always trying to make out everything is sooo exciting. Nor are they timid, like the BBC, fearful of opining on anything controversial, where the most radical thing you'll hear is "he'll be disappointed with that, Gary". They tell it like it is, so when Giles says Gerrard is not a proper midfielder, and then shrugs his shoulders, as if to say "well, there it is, what do you want me to do about?", well, you tend to listen.

 

I know, Giles doesn't have the market cornered on football insight. But I think he's right on this one. And if Gerrard isn't a proper midfielder, well, what is he?

[lawrie]

wish you hadn't opened it here - over on RAWK this thread takes the term 'over egging the pudding' to a truly laughable level

[sean]

with all the talk of his position and his 'body language' on here it's well worth an airing

[floyd the barber]

think hes right...

 

Gerrard is more a nedved,zidanne type and the more he realises this and gets over this "im a central midfielder thats where im happiest" stuff..............the better

[Sir Tokyo Sexwale]

he's a talisman

 

 

 

 

 

or something

 

 

probably

[Maldini]

That article is very old, but Giles is right, he might not have expressed it in the right way, but the last three years has seen a change in Gerrard to the effect that now his most effective work is in the final third of the pitch, before it was the middle third. Now he is the spark that ignites our fire, whereas before he was the petrol.

[_00_deathscar]

Reading the responses on RAWK, the vitriol reserved for Gerrard by some there is past embarassing...

[Guest Kev]

Stevie is the best English central midfielder around.

Stevie is probably in the top five central midfielders in the world.

Stevie is definately in the top five central midfielders in Europe.

 

Why the f*** Rafa and England play him on the right defies belief for me.

[John am Rhein]

There's more than one kind of midfielder. Gerrard just isn't the Souness/Giles type. He's still a midfielder, though. And a considerably better one for being able to play more positions.

[intense enigma]

Stevie is the best English central midfielder around.

Stevie is probably in the top five central midfielders in the world.

Stevie is definately in the top five central midfielders in Europe.

 

Why the f*** Rafa and England play him on the right defies belief for me.

 

Maybe because

 

Rafa is the best manager in English football around.

Rafa is probably in the top five managers in the world.

Rafa is definately in the top five managers in Europe.

 

As for England, i shall stop here

[Guest Kev]

Maybe because

 

Rafa is the best manager in English football around.

Rafa is probably in the top five managers in the world.

Rafa is definately in the top five managers in Europe.

 

As for England, i shall stop here

 

Maybe because

 

Kev is the best knowledgable poster around.

Kev is probably in the top five knowledgable posters in the world.

Kev is definately in the top five knowledgable posters in Europe.

 

Edited October 8, 2006 by Kev

[intense enigma]

Maybe because

 

Kev is the best knowledgable poster around.

Kev is probably in the top five knowledgable posters in the world.

Kev is definately in the top five knowledgable posters in Europe.

 

 

You missed out Kev's standing in the 'doom and gloom' top five

[Guest Kev]

You missed out Kev's standing in the 'doom and gloom' top five

 

International break, I can't see the gloom for the doom

[kop205]

Thought Gerard looked like a fantastic prospect a few years ago - was it Barca he played for? Seems to have disappeared of the radar a bit though - suppose the like of Xavi came through, they bought Deco etc.

 

Where is he now?

 

Shouldn't this be in the general football forum?

[_00_deathscar]

Nah nah..you're mistaken Kop205.

 

It's CLEARLY talking about Houllier.

[John am Rhein]

Stevie is the best English central midfielder around.

Stevie is probably in the top five central midfielders in the world.

Stevie is definately in the top five central midfielders in Europe.

 

Why the f*** Rafa and England play him on the right defies belief for me.

 

Because:

 

he's the best English right midfielder around

he's probably in the top five right midfielders in the world

he's definitely in the top five right midfielders in Europe

 

and, as far as Liverpool goes (f*ck England), we also have Alonso and Sissoko

[Dule]

I agree with what Maldini said. Ive actually been thinking it for a while now.

 

Its hard to call Gerrard Lazy but he just does not seem to track back as much as he used to (last year of Houlier's rein). Ive been puting it down to instructions by Rafa on choosing when to express himself and when to reserve his energy. Now its either what i just said, or he does not have the fuel in the tank?

 

My United mate (who loves Gerrard) keeps telling me that SG looks tired almost every game since February this year, and i think he is right.

 

In conclusion, ill say this. Gerrard wants to be involved in everything, but more so in attack. He does not realise this yet i dont think, because if he did he would not be complaining about his position in the team at the moment. And before people attack me about him not complaining that is b****x. Yes he is playing in the position and yes he has not said much to the media (if at all). But you can clearly see that he is not 100% happy playing where he is from body language and responses during matches.

[Guest Sabre]

Two instances yesterday (both similar to what I describe below) of why he has moved out of being a midfielder and become a player who doesn't really have any responsibility (in his own mind) other than attacking and making goals:

 

He's playing right midfield in quite frankly a terribly put together midfield with no shape and no discipline. Macedonia race forward on the counter attack and Gerrard puts in a lame challenge which doesn't work out. Opposition keep going, Gerrard trots after his man and Macedonia almost score. This happened just before half time and if I were McClaren, Gerrard would have received a sodding earful (although the rest of the team weren't much better). He's turning into a sod that just wants to be the centre of attention and he needs to reign it in. Being suspended for Wednesday is the best thing that could have happened to him. Get back in front of Rafa and get back to basics. If you want to be a superstar, start playing like one.

[Cooldude]

Rafa needs to beat it into him to do the tracking back and all that s*** that Gerrard used to do 4-5 years ago and things that he used to be renowned for

 

His game's changed closer to Lampard's, which is not what we need, nor England.

[lawrie]

Sabre you just can't help yourself can you?

[anny road]

Stevie is the best English central midfielder around.

Stevie is probably in the top five central midfielders in the world.

Stevie is definately in the top five central midfielders in Europe.

 

Why the f*** Rafa and England play him on the right defies belief for me.

 

 

maybe they know something you dont

[Guz]

That article is very old, but Giles is right, he might not have expressed it in the right way, but the last three years has seen a change in Gerrard to the effect that now his most effective work is in the final third of the pitch, before it was the middle third.

 

Good point that and I think you're spot on.

 

He's turning into a sod that just wants to be the centre of attention and he needs to reign it in.

 

No.

 

It's the press/media that make him the centre of attention and our own fans fall for it hook line and sinker.

[Earl Hafler]

Good point that and I think you're spot on.

 

 

 

No.

 

It's the press/media that make him the centre of attention and our own fans fall for it hook line and sinker.

 

Aye, that shot of him running towards the crowd, pointing at himself shouting " I'm the man " was constructed by Dreamworks.

[Dan]

Gerrard is the best attacking midfielder around.

 

He is capable of defending very well (RB in Istanbul), but isn't disciplined enough to do it when put in the centre as his natural instinct is to go forward.

[Guz]

Aye, that shot of him running towards the crowd, pointing at himself shouting " I'm the man " was constructed by Dreamworks.

 

That was almost 2 years ago now and the only debate then was about whether he'd stay at the club, not what position he'd play. We got results with playing Xabi, Momo and Stevie last year the way we do and no one complained about his defensive ability or whatever. Now we lose a few and it's Gerrard this and Gerrard that from the press about him playing on the right and our fans can't help but getting sucked into it.

 

It's clear SG wants to play in the middle (no idea why tbh because he gets s*** loads of freedom from the right) but has done nothing to the deteremant of the team since his u-turn 15 months ago. If people think bringing out a book and doing Hello photo shoots is harmful to the team then so be it but I couldn't give a f*** about that and I dont understand half the s*** that Gerrard gets after games when we lose. People moan about the press calling us a 1-man team when we win but when we lose you can guarantee there's always something to be said about Gerrard, probably more than anyone else. For what it's worth, apart from Agger, he's been our best player this season although that's saying very little in the big context as everyone has been mediocre at best.