Police to clamp down on some derby songs

[Jacks Jackie Jackson]

http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/liverpool-f...00252-22700007/

 

There were some vermin amongst our support under the stand at Stoke last week and although I don't know how effective this will be, something has to be done. The Munich songs go completely unchecked now and no longer get shouted down and the songs about what will happen to Everton when they come to Anfield are plain embarrassing. It's going to be as bad when we play Everton as it is when we play Man Utd the way things are going. If it's not already.

[Tommy Cockles]

Waaaay to much attention is being given to what gangs of lads sing at football matches.

 

It isn't social comment. It isn't really anything at all in the scheme of things.

 

There are much more important things to worry about, there really are.

[kop205]

I was at Stoke but only got in about 10 minutes before kick off so don't know what was being sung about the blues**** (it was 'Liverbird' when I got in).

 

Without necessarily going into full detail or lyrics, was it new stuff that was being sung? What was the gist of it?

[johngibo YPC]

DIdn't hear any of the Everton stuff, and don't think anything was song about either club during the game, but the Munich stuff was booming out in the concourse, which was odd

[kop205]

DIdn't hear any of the Everton stuff, and don't think anything was song about either club during the game, but the Munich stuff was booming out in the concourse, which was odd

 

I don't get to loads of aways (only Blackburn, Bolton and Stoke this season - I'll have to check with A@A whether that makes me a 'supporter' or a 'follower' or something else) but it was noticeably 'bouncier' down in the concourse than for either of the others I've been to this season (due in large part to the kick off time I imagine).

 

In itself, that 'bounciness' is a good thing, though maybe the odd d****ead is more likely to surface too (there a couple of right pricks sat by us with whom a few words were exchanged).

[johngibo YPC]

I don't get to loads of aways (only Blackburn, Bolton and Stoke this season - I'll have to check with A@A whether that makes me a 'supporter' or a 'follower' or something else) but it was noticeably 'bouncier' down in the concourse than for either of the others I've been to this season (due in large part to the kick off time I imagine).

 

In itself, that 'bounciness' is a good thing, though maybe the odd d****ead is more likely to surface too (there a couple of right pricks sat by us with whom a few words were exchanged).

 

I reckon a 'viewer'

 

Wasn't just the odd one. Loads were singing it. Seems to happen one every couple of years though

[Jacks Jackie Jackson]

I was at Stoke but only got in about 10 minutes before kick off so don't know what was being sung about the blues**** (it was 'Liverbird' when I got in).

 

Without necessarily going into full detail or lyrics, was it new stuff that was being sung? What was the gist of it?

 

There was one new one about what will happen when Everton come to Anfield (how daft; some of them are brothers/cousins and other relatives) and the Kensington one got a few airings as well.

 

And as for Tommy Cockles' point of view; you're wrong. Those of us who lived through the violence of the 70s and 80s regarded the more recent better mood in grounds to be preferable to what had gone before but now we can see it going back again. The songs fire people up and violence is the end result. You never used to hear anyone refer to Munich but now the word is bandied about as though that was the name of their club. I don't go along with the "they started it" nonesense either.

[RP]

(At the few games I get to these days) I have heard an increase in the songs at games over the last 4 or 5 years I guess - but seen no increase in violence whatsoever. So I disagree with the link you are making.

[johngibo YPC]

(At the few games I get to these days) I have heard an increase in the songs at games over the last 4 or 5 years I guess - but seen no increase in violence whatsoever. So I disagree with the link you are making.

 

It feels like its proper going to off one of these days. Probably more likely at Goodison

I personally wouldnt sit in the Everton end now, like i did in 2001

Personally don't think the 'what we are going to do to you' songs are the problem though. That sort of macho posturing has always gone on

[Murphman]

(At the few games I get to these days) I have heard an increase in the songs at games over the last 4 or 5 years I guess - but seen no increase in violence whatsoever. So I disagree with the link you are making.

 

 

You don't get punch ups in the hospitality suites.

[Jacks Jackie Jackson]

(At the few games I get to these days) I have heard an increase in the songs at games over the last 4 or 5 years I guess - but seen no increase in violence whatsoever. So I disagree with the link you are making.

 

Well you must have your eyes closed then because there's far more violence outside Goodison now than there's ever been (with us) and it's worse at OT than at any time since the 80s and it gets worse every year.

[CarraLegend]

If you sing a song you're a violent thug.

[kop205]

I reckon a 'viewer'

 

Wasn't just the odd one. Loads were singing it. Seems to happen one every couple of years though

 

Oh aye, I don't doubt there were loads doing the Munich stuff, but by 'the odd d****ead' I was really meaning the ones who seem to have that extra bit of edge to them and seem to spend half their time on the verge of kicking off on other redmen.

 

Some of the songs may be unplesant but they are, as people have said, for the most part macho posturing that has gone on for ages. Whether they might play a part in finally tipping some of the more unhinged over the edge, I'm not certain.

[johngibo YPC]

and it's worse at OT than at any time since the 80s and it gets worse every year.

 

Well f*ck all happened last year to be fair

[Jacks Jackie Jackson]

Well f*ck all happened last year to be fair

 

Being Easter Sunday, I reckoned I could well do without the aggrovation so I gave it a swerve. My son though reckoned the chanting and hatred towards each other inside the ground was the worst he's yet experienced.

[kop205]

The songs fire people up and violence is the end result.

 

I'd say that where violence results it is more down to ale than to songs.

 

Most people can have a bevvy without becoming violent so we'd all be pretty pissed off if we got told we had to be tee-total when before, during and after games.

 

Most people can sing pretty much anything they choose without becoming violent, so whereas I'm not saying that the songs are pleasant or desireable, you are maybe overstating their significance in terms of possible consequences.

 

Don't get me wrong, I'd rather certain songs were booed down, especially when we aren't even playing the teams being sung about. I just think it is mainly pissed up loudmouths without really much potential or desire to do serious damage.

Edited January 15, 2009 by kop205

[Jacks Jackie Jackson]

I'd say that where violence results it is more down to ale than to songs.

 

Most people can have a bevvy without becoming violent so we'd all be pretty pissed off if we got told we had to be tee-total when before, during and after games.

 

Most people can sing pretty much anything they choose without becoming violent.

 

Again, I'm not saying that the songs are pleasant or desireable, just that you are mayber overstating their significance in terms of possible consequences.

 

 

I don't think I am. The songs may not fire you or me to commit acts of violence but the younger lads coming through (the ones most likely to commit the violence; god knows we've seen enough of it when football's not even involved) are now taught that Man Utd are "Munich" and their fans are "Munichs"; Everton are now fair game with songs outlining what's going to happen to them and what did happen in Kensington; and this is the intimidatory atmosphere they're being immersed into. Songs including lines like, "we only carry hatchets to bury in your head" and "heard of the Anny Road aggro" will be taken quite literally by some who will seek to claim some glorification for acting out the violence depicted in the songs. Equally, fans of other clubs could justify attacks on people singing derogatory songs about them or their team or get so wound up listening to such songs, the spark to the violence is already there.

[Jarg Armani]

no song sung by either set of fans is illegal, going by the precedent of the sol campbell thing, so i don't see what the police can do.

 

it's an exercise in futility unless they come out, like they did today, front of the echo, and go "the murderers one, the elephant man, the baby's not yours, the kensington one, all the horrific fence munching/wall pushing, all these will be punished"

 

even if they don't go through with it, saying this at least proves they aren't just using big talk.

 

fwiw i think it's a nonsense, apart from the fact that it's impossible to clamp down on singing, it wouldn't be something i'd like to see happen.

 

it would be easier to single out people doing the horrible mimes they do, and if they did i wouldn't complain to be honest.

 

edit. i'll just add that personally i don't find any song on either side offensive except 'you killed your own fans' and '96 wasn't enough', which are beyond the pale and should always remain so. for me anyway.

Edited January 15, 2009 by Jarg Armani

[Gunga Din]

It feels like its proper going to off one of these days. Probably more likely at Goodison

I personally wouldnt sit in the Everton end now, like i did in 2001

Personally don't think the 'what we are going to do to you' songs are the problem though. That sort of macho posturing has always gone on

 

i reckon a game against the Mancs pretty soon will be chaos. with every passing game the atmosphere games more and more hostile

[allez les rouges]

i reckon a game against the Mancs pretty soon will be chaos. with every passing game the atmosphere games more and more hostile

 

the manc games i remember over the last 20 years or so have been well worse than recent. Its still got a long way to go even before it gets to the mid 90's level

[allez les rouges]

does the purple acki song come into this? its as racist as singing rooney is a fat b*****d.

[Molby]

thing is...who cares?

 

I mean so f***ing what?

[cymrococh]

I notice that criminal chanting is in quotation marks in the beginning of that report. Does that mean that it is a quote from a police officer or that no such thing exists?

[Stevie H]

I notice that criminal chanting is in quotation marks in the beginning of that report. Does that mean that it is a quote from a police officer or that no such thing exists?

“At a previous derby at Anfield there was some pretty unpleasant chanting from both sets of supporters, although it was not racist or homophobic.”

 

then it's not illegal, is it? perhaps they should also arrest anyone who is thinking bad thoughts about tim cahill.

[cymrococh]

It's like the Ashley Cole/mobile/hole song that nearly got anny road chucked out of Highbury for homophobic chanting. It's not homophobic, firstly because he's supposedly not gay and secondly because sticking your phone up yourself isn't a homosexual act, it's just really stupid.

 

PCGM.