carrafan

Went in for the low deflected cross with his right foot and completely mistimed it when he could also have gone with his left. Nothing really, it was an unlucky, one in a hundred miss which also happened to Gerrard in the 2nd half. I think people are making too much of it.

With regards to the goal... Is there such a rule?

Think he's been waaay better than his first season, as well. He's a very good pure defensive mid even if you take out his game intelligence and passing while his close control has improved a lot from his first season. Rafa definitely dodged a bullet with Alonso and hopefully both parties will be professional about what happened and we'll tie him down on a long term deal asap.

Alonso Carragher Kuyt

Hahaha, fair play to them. Top of the table as well.

At least we're in a Liverpool forum though. Welcome back, btw.

No quotes in the Times article.

Degen is 6 foot 1 and taller than your average fullback. If anything a 5 foot 9 Aurelio might be targetted.

So we've decided that he's s**** and a no hoper who has to leave asap?

Yes. And i think if he's not completely match fit, which is different from being just fit, then i think he should be eased into the games. 30 minute spells when we're winning makes sense to me. Obviously only Rafa, Torres and the backroom staff know how fit he exactly is. Reina Degen Carragher Agger Aurelio Kuyt Alonso Mascherano Riera Gerrard Keane

Lets face it, there are very few fullbacks in the world who defend very well and are absolutely brilliant going forward. Luckily for the attacking fullbacks in big teams, games in which they'll be put under the cosh are few and far between. Everybody raved about Bosingwa when he was brought in but Riera tore him a new bum with his close control and physical game when we played Chelsea. Does that mean Bosingwa is a bad player? No. A team has to be chosen according the strengths of the players playing in it. When we were never going to boss the midfield yesterday, playing attacking fullbacks made no sense. Add to that them getting absolutely no support from midfield or teh fullbacks it was like throwing rats in a snakes pit. Dossena's confidence was shot the moment he made the first mistake and the crowd would have got on him back everytime he did something questionable. Thats only a downward spiral for a player who hasnt settled yet and is low on confidence. Noticed how Degen automatically looked a better player the moment Alonso came on and we caught some grip in midfield? That will happen more often in the league we the likes of Alonso and Gerrard will play, Kuyt and Riera will press from the front but also provide the defenders some support. We have to give our players some time and support. This 'I want this to work and i want it right now' attitude will lead us nowhere. That said, i'd like to see Dossena and Degen play for the reserves till they're used to our system and the language.

Dossena put in one of the worst displays i've seen from a fullback for a good while, yesterday. But both him and Degen are attacking fullbacks and were clearly out of their element when the midfield werent bossing the game and they werent getting any support from our wingers/spare defensive midfielder. Must have been tough for them getting slack from our wonderful fans (who had probably decided that they are s**** the moment they were bought) for every mistake they made. Hell, i even saw Insua being called names when he miscued a shot a bit and he's one of the liked ones! We have no Italian in the squad or in England, so Dossena must be feeling out of place. And he's been asked to play in a completely new system to what he played in Udinese. I still think he'll make it if and only if he adapts to life in Liverpool. The moment we started bossing the game yesterday, Degen looked like a good attacking fullback and should have won us a definite peno when he raped Bale for pace and dribbling skill. Similarly, put both of them in a game where we boss the midfield and control the game, they'll do well i.e. they'll do what they're good and and were bought for. Yesterday was a team which was a mix and match of players coming from an injury, squad players and reserves being played just to give the first team a break who have no chance of playing otherwise.

I'd be surprised if Torres started this one and he looked waay to rusty against Tottenham.

Tottenham buy loads of promising young english players and the good ones come through. Same for Arsenal, they buy f***loads for the reserves. The shame about the reserve system is that it isnt anywhere near the quality of the first team and that is the reason that lesser and lesser youth players are coming through when compared to a few years before. The reserve games are too few and far apart to infer anything from them and at Liverpool the players who are on the fringes of the first team like El zhar, Insua, Ngog and Nemeth are allowed to train with the first team. Whoever does the best is being played, i guess. Survival of the fittest is the name of the game when it comes to a young player getting looking to become a senior player in the English system, i reckon. I dont think a lot can be inferred from yesterday's game to be honest. We played with 2 attacking fullbacks who got absolutely no support from the fullbacks. The midfield didnt boss yesterday which meant that our fullbacks couldnt do what they were bought to do, be average defensively but provide a genuine threat upfront. The moment Degen started going forward, he didnt look like a freebie from Germany. Dossena is a poor defender and never got into his element when Plessis didnt provide him with the support Mascherano usually does. Degen/Dossena wont look half as bad as they did yesterday if they play against Bolton, that is a guarantee.

To be fair to the lad, NGog is only 19... and wasnt in the Degen/Voronin mode of signings when he was bought. He put in the most inept of performances yesterday but the scouts must have seen something in him. He also did well in pre season where Rafa went out of his way to say that the lad had to get some upper body strength but has some pace and played targetman when he did for PSG. Ngog fits right into the 4231 that we prefer. I was disgusted at what we saw from him yesterday, but writing him off this early makes no sense because its the same to what we did for El Zhar last year and now almost everyone wants him to play the odd game here and there. Ngog is 3 years younger to Nabil as well. I'd love it if we could get Armand Traore off Arsenal if we're looking for an attacking left back. He'll be sent on loan time and again as Clichy is one of the best left backs in the league and he might come here if we're ready to give him the games.

El Zhar didnt provide his fullback support nor was he any good out wide on the ball. Thought he only improved when he played inside in the 2nd half. El Zhar was criminal in the first half for not marking Bale when he went forward as well.

Just when Dee was getting round to liking him ..

Thats about the gist of it.

The 'injury' came at just the wrong time for us. We had just scored and were putting a lot of pressure on them.

We had far worse players on the pitch yesterday. What must Pennant have done to piss Rafa off i'll never know. I thought it was great attitude from him to play for the reserves last season when he wasnt getting the games. Dossena, Cavilieri, Degen etc should be played in the reserves till they are in tune with the tactics, city etc.

That was Cristian Bolanos.

Lucas Alonso El Zhar Can we vote for Gomes?

Lucas MOTM definitely, looked like the only one who gave a f***.

Arent recreational drugs illegal?

This content is not viewable to guests.,This content is not viewable to guests.