fabfive

Banks don't really care about net spend, supporters do. That is a different issue. The issue is the viability of the clubs finances with or without Champions League money. The ability to refinance. The additional corporate deals that enhance revenue streams. That is what the bloody accountants will be fixated on. Not who is in the team or how good we are playing. Those are very minor to the discussions of a refinace.

No brainer? 1: Owen needs a partner and would not play as effectively as a Torres replacement in our 4-2-3-1. Unless you want him out on the wing. 2: Rafa probably didn't need the "Keane" treatment from the media as to why Owen is on the bench and not starting enough. Owen publically said he wanted a move away from newcastle to improve his chances to be in the World Cup squad for England. The media is World Cup frenzy driven. Rafa would have been questioned repeatedly about Owen. After all we can't have England fail can we. 3: Owens injury record. Regardless of him not being crocked yet, it was a definite concern during the transfer season. Man utd could take that risk. Rafa couldn't. 4: It's easy to say we could afford him but could we? No one in here knows his salary demands. Or his "thoughts" about playing time. 5: What about the developement of N'Gog. With Owen in the side, David slides down the pecking order and we may not disover his talents. Maybe he wants to leave us because he's being overlooked and Rafa takes another rap of not giving the kids a chance. As it is, N'Gog has more goals per minute in the League played than some strikers people want in ( Bellamy, Crouch, even Owen) So the brain does indeed need to process a lot of factors. Some seen, some unseen.

Ok. We'll know come this summer then. But if they refinance again based on increased revenues due to corporate sponsors, then what.

Best thread in awhile. Good to have a laugh every now and then.

But you're in a bit of a time warp. What happened last summer is on the record, no doubt about it. The banks wanted less debt and G&H had to stump up. Since then new sponsorship deals have been announced with a few companies most notably Standard Chartered. So Ayers and Purslow have been bringing in the additional revenue to keep G&H from needing to stump up much if anything at all. If we don't make 4th and are not in next years CL, we still get paid this summer for this seasons Uefa exploits. So we don't really get hurt until the summer of 2011 financially. That gives G&H at least until then to find additional investors or a buyer. If we make 4th this season, then G&H have until 2012 or beyond.

Souness said if we don't get at least 4ht place he feared a meldown and Torres being sold. Ergo: Solution is at least get 4th.

Lucas did it last season with Alonso in the side and was effective. He did it this season with Spearing as well. It was Jay who had the mare. I suspect Rafa will team Lucas and Aquilani if he fears Masch is leaving just to see how they get on.

First off, i'm in the Rafa must stay group. As the thread with Mr Biscan and his contract shows. But to drop a bombshell in this argument, people have commented Purslow and Ayers have done well for the club. These are G&H's appointments since taking over. Would it be a huge leap to say they wouldn't find a suitable replacement who could take us to the next level for Rafa if Rafa fecks off to Madrid?

The atmosphere has been pathetic for some time to be fair..

It's definately not my site. But for me, as long as someone is just posting their opinions and not personal attacks on others they should be allowed to post. Obvious wind up merchants should go as well and I think the site takes care of those. I have a problem with Mr. Biscan/Ant and him wanting Rafa gone. Polar opposite to me. I'll debate him on it. But i don't want him gone because of it. Not that I really have a say.

Being nice to someone to their face ( at the ground) and stabbing them in the back when you leave, is not exactly "supporting" the manager at the game or otherwise. Supporting the manager would not be wanting to see him get the sack or leave whether in the ground or away. Questioning various decisions or tactics is still supporting the manager because you don't want him to go and you are just baffled by what he does. But what he does has brought us loads. And he really, really doesn't need to explain every 5 minutes of the match to our satisfaction. Why give away his decision making for our rivals to pick up on.

So is Mr. Biscan going to get his way and Rafa go off on the owners? Or Rafa get fired? Or we have more threads on the topic? Or will he come to the conclusion that when it comes to supporting Liverpool Football Club, the manager is part and parcle of that and that he won't get his dearest wish. Not even from Kris Kringle. So his hopes will be dashed and that leaves the rest of us to go about our business and Mr. Biscan to join the bitters, in mind only.

Amen to that. We don't see it as a priviledge some times but we are truely blessed to follow our club.

Especially when N'Gog has scored 1 less goal than Bellamy and with considerable less minutes played.

That would do. And I think we will. We are starting to keep clean sheets once again. And for all the "discussion" about various players, in the main, scoring goals hasn't been a problem. We aren't miles behind the other top four in that regard. Even with all our injuries.

You and me both. It's not like King Kenny didn't have a bevvie either. Times are different now. if Robbie was coming through he'd have different guidence and probably a different lifestyle. Much like Torres. Doesn't mean Robbie would score more goals though. Or have less injuries.

England v Germany in the round of 16 when Algeria win the group. 2nd v 1st

And what experience do you have as a working man at a high level of management that shows you can speak out against the owners and they'll leave? Pie in the sky stuff really. There is not a chance in hell Rafa speaking out about not getting funds for transfers will make the owners sell. Or about them lying about switching brands of teabags. What you want, you don't always get. And yours is a folly of the highest order. Fans already know about G&H's lies. Some suspect, like you they lied to Rafa. So what. Where's your picket signs at Anfield match days informing punters G&H lied to Rafa? They OWN the club. Get that through your skull and process it. They don't have to sell unless they want to. They don't ever have to come back to Liverpool if they don't want to. People can protest away, block the entrance, make fools of themselves, risk being arrested, and the owners will still own the club. Rafa is powerless to remove them unless he secretly goes and gets a Sheikh and drags G&H to the table to sell to the Sheikh ( or whomever). The only thing Rafa can do is effect his employment by doing something stupid, to suit you no doubt. When he loves the club. Montse does too. His kids are happy here. Yet you want him to chuck it down the loo just for you to be happy. Good luck, lar.

It's absurd not to back Rafa. People can and will get frustrated but not backing the manager will only make matters far worse.

PeeG; I'm certainly not having a go at all SOS does. I doubt the "quite" days when there is no protest and the like G&H think, well we've won them over. I think SOS has set out it's stall and G&H are well aware of the resistence to them. But they just don't care. As owners what they will do is run the club as they see fit. Doing the financials and working with the banks to keep things viable. Rafa has got his way and now runs the Academy. Purslow and Ayers are out securing new sponsorship deals. Things are being done daily/weekly to take the club forward----in the minds of G&H. So they don't care about a few protests. What does it mean to them? SOS can counter their PR releases or come up with your own "facts". But how many minds does it win over? And that is what G&H look to see. SOS can counter about G&H not going to get the next loan, but then they do. Then what? Say they won't get another loan in a years time and they do again. So round and round it goes. You're quite right the media move on to the next story. So it is an unwinable situation to be able to keep the anti G&H factor going in the media. The media are more interested in the results and Rafa getting the boot. That is what other supporters are interested in. LFC sliding to mid table mediocrity. So the media plays up the teams failures. The only link is how much money Rafa has to spend. Then the media have a go at G&H. But they really don't give a s*** if G&H go. They might care if sugar daddy comes in and gives Rafa a bazillion to spend. Then they'd have something to write about and worry about Man Utds reign coming to an end. Doomsday scenarios would be rife because United will be dethroned. I don't envy SOS and the work necessary. But surely the emphasis should be winning the minds of season ticket holders and getting them to be members. The rest of it is superficial to some extent. The power of SOS will be demonstrated by having the numbers against G&H from the core support. G&H get their money from the ST's. That is the majority of those who attend Anfield. SOS needs to understand why ST's aren't joining in droves and attempt to rectify that. Imho. Even long term with any owner, SOS's power will come from that core base. Much as over the years managers have been made redundant because they lost the support of the fans. Management reacts to the majority. But even saying that, how does management sack itself? Which is basically SOS's demand and that of many of us. Tough nut that one. But I still think it will come from when SOS has support from a majority of ST's.

Are the media really interested? That is the crux of the issue. It does seem a few SOS reports get played out in the media but then the next day or match rolls around and all is forgotten. SOS need to rethink how to attact those people who have not joined up yet. To get their own numbers up. To become a real force to be recond with. The limited protests or something like the Fiorentina protest gig at the ground does what exactly? Does it get the owners out? Do they care? Do the media care beyond 5 minutes? Or is this being done to keep a some SOS members happy that "we're doing something to show G&H we don't want them here"? Don't shoot the messenger but G&H will only react to someone coming up with the money to buy them out. They will only react if there is a massive demonstartion and/or walkout. All of that is unlikely unless SOS increases it's membership 5-10 fold. SOS should concentrate on season ticket holders. All the oot'ers don't really matter as they are not there in numbers to march or walkout. Until such time as SOS can demonstrate they do represent the vast majority of those who come week in and week out G&H have little to fear. Imho, of course.

Agree with this. Vladi never shirked his duties and played for the shirt. Glad it ended in Legend status for Istanbul.

He's off Fox and Sirius which are the public channels. Job done by those involved. That he's gone to a podcast to save any of his a*** is laughable. I'm sure his legions of followers will buy a subscription. And then he chat with like minded souls.

Not clear on that am I. I guess it's made up b****x because some think we had a chance at Turner. And I tried to explain that Rafa and the club probably weren't contacted by Brown with his tail between his legs saying he'd take our offer of 6mil. So to assume we had a chance at Turner and the lower fee would be the made up part....

Not to mention the quota on nationality that exists. Turner would fit that bill, Zorba doesn't. Stil I think it's all made up b****x. Brown may have been trying to extort money out of us and other top clubs, didn't get it, and had to sell late in the transfer window. By then he'd probably pissed off Rafa who was looking elsewhere. There's nothing that says Brown came back to us wanting to accept our 6mil or even taken less from us. So he sold elsewhere and only now the financials come out. Brown is the one who fecked that up for Hull City. Not Rafa, or G&H, for us. Imho of course.