JRC

Except he followed that up at the post-match conference with "What are you lot going to do now? All those Liverpool fans, especially in the local press. The way you build that side up. I bet you're all stunned tonight. We completely controlled the game" So there's never a pro-Everton voice on City, or Merseyside, or in the Post or Echo is there? And that Prentice is such an Uber-Red isn't he? And 'completely controlled the game'!? He wouldn't know 'class and dignity' if it bit his a**e

Copyright - Wigan; evidence apparently of Ridiculous Rafa cracking up - and a game we actually were winning at the time, remember

I don't know why a scapegoat is needed, but to dismiss that there are scapegoats as 'internet nonsense' is to fly in the face of the evidence here and at the match (and on the phone-ins, but they often represent such ur-fandom as not to be worthy of serious consideration). Firstly, it's not true about 'if the team plays well etc. no-one gets highlighted'. Sit by me in the Main Stand, and win, lose or draw, struggle or batter, the usual suspects get berated and abused. Kuyt's form was excellent earlier this season, and he was scoring goals, but it mattered not one jot for the loudmouth thick-ears, they just remained silent when he did somnething worthwhile, but were he to miscontrol a pass, he would get down the banks, as usual. Of course failings get highlighted, and criticized, and some players have earned credit in the bank as it were, and others can eventually 'win the fans over', but the point about scapegoating is not that it is without reason, but the disproportionate nature of the failure to acknowledge the positive reasons and propensity to highlight the bad reasons depending on the player in question, to the point where many appear to have reached a decision of extreme prejudice about how they are going to judge them, come what may - and use any opportunity to lay the team's failings at their feet.

At least Babel has the physical attributes to play the Torres role when asked - pacey, strong, control, aerial presence(ish). That his form is currently rubbish is, unfortunately, a consideration he shares with Robbie Keane, so not decisive.

Of course, with Spurs coming here on the last day of the season, you just KNOW what is going to happen, don't you? * With Spurs needing a point against the already-crowned champions to avoid relegation, Robbie Keane contrives to miss 3 open goals that look easier to score...what else could it be?

Not sure about this. I always cavil at the oft-heard complaint that 'we play 2 Holding (or Defensive) Midfielders and 1 up Front, and at home'. Not only is the Gerrard-Torres axis a positive one, but I don't see Xabi and Masch as 2 Holding. Masch does fantastic work protecting the defence, but at his best, his energy and mobility is such that he doesn't simply hold, he is active in Centre Mid as well - although he obviously offers less going forward. He's the closest to a Defensive Midfielder, but he is hardly a Makele or even a Didi patrolling 10 yards in front of the back 4 and mopping up. Not sure what I'd call Xabi - there has been a lot of talk on here about 'Deep-Lying', 'quarterback', 'playmaker' etc, but while he reads the game well enough to do a defensive shift when the opposition attacks, the fact that he comes and collects the ball as deep as he does doesn't make him a Holding player or DM. He's always about moving the ball on, and looking for the pass. That's not to say I don't think he should (or should be charged to) do more further up - as Carrick is doing; but my recollection of his appearances for Spain this Summer was that he was often found in much more attacking positions, and offering a threat, than he does with us.

That's true - and I don't think it unfair to say that Rafa was the first manager to really put that plan into effect and show the rest how to do it.

Forgot to add Cech, he now looks a liability. Punched every cross even when not under pressure; even the shot-stopping Pearce claimed he was still brilliant at looked laboured, and twice put the ball straight back in the danger zone

I was slightly concerned when Drogba came on yesterday. He's better at working as a lone striker than Anelka, could help them out defensively when we went all hands to the pump, and may have still had something to prove to Rafa - and maybe Scolari as well. We all have to admit that he can bully the best defender on his day. Then the first time the ball comes near him, Jamie just eases him off it, the shoulders go up, the outstretched palms, the outraged glare at some other blameless colleague.....yes, it was THAT Drogba out there, and I knew I could rest easy. Especially as they also had Ballack, Malouda, Kalou, Mikel, Anelka and, tbh, Lampard before he went in pretty much the same kind of form. I could well understand why most Chelsea fans calling into the phone-ins were not really blaming Riley or having a pop at us but bemoaning their own team. Say what you like about Ferguson, but he's clearly qualified to judge the overall, ongoing quality of a squad required to challenge at the top level, and his pre-season call about them plateauing looks right on the money.

This content is not viewable to guests.

Having a player sent off these days is an advantage to the other team of course, but teams surely train for playing with 10 men, as they are all going to experience it a few times a season, and is by no means a 'gimme', as Stoke - or more correctly City - proved yesterday. I think it makes winning harder for the team with 10 men, but scarcely impacts their defensive set-up, and even consolidates it.

Yossi was good, but Dirk, poor as some of his play was, did the disciplined stuff for 75 minutes or so - stayed wide, always available for the ball(even if he didn't always control it), and most importantly, kept Cole from going forward at all. Not sure Yossi would have dome that as well.

Surprised to read one report that Benitez's substitutions were cautious, same as against the 10 of Arsenal.. Babel on for Mascherano cautious? For once we really went for them, and got our just desserts. Felt I could listen to the Radio for once on the way home. First conversation (606) - Spoony talking about Robbie Keane with a Manc guest saying how badly he was getting treated after playing so well.. turned to Talk**te where it was about 'sympathy' for Chelsea, though tbf, none of the Chelsea callers wanted any sympathy, and said the best team won anyway - so the presenter raised a different subject - 'does this win just paper over the cracks at Liverpool?'. So it was radio silence the rest of the way home again.

Rafa saoid he'd already decided to take Stevie off before Wigan scored, and in fact I would have had little problem with that - he was clearly struggling and ineffective, and we were 1-0 up and needed to control the endgame if, as it looked, we weren't going to score again ourselves. Once they scored, it was a no-brainer for me that he stayed on (2006 FA Cup etc. etc.), but Rafa doesn't work that way, and clearly got it wrong. But I think some of the other mistakes he has been accused of have been overplayed - playing/not playing Keane, subbing Torres etc. Not sure yet if Wenger is getting or going to get the same kind of stick from the Press & Pundits for 3 consecutive draws - with worse opposition (Cardiff), scoring a fortunate late equalizer after being outplayed rather than conceding one after controlling as it was for us, then benching his most potent matchwinner.

This content is not viewable to guests.

Marcotti has excellent journalistic contacts and insight on matters like lengths of contracts, agents, transfer targets etc. He has a wide knowledge of the teams and players across Europe. His actual understanding and appreciation of the game is embarassingly weak.

This content is not viewable to guests.

This content is not viewable to guests.

I heard that and was astounded - he compounded that by claiming Vidic as an example of a player no-one had heard of who dropped straight in without time to adjust - I'm pretty sure he was being dismissed as a donkey for about the first 3 months; but then, even more bizarre he contrasted Vidic with Rafa buying well-known, established internationals who struggle to settle; and those players? Arbeloa and Dossena! The latter may turn out a flop, but I thnk putting Messi in your pocket in the Camp Nou in your first game counts as 'settling' You couldn't make it up, although I suspect that's exactly what Stan does. Worse, Danny Kelly - I used to like him, but he's been well and truly TalkSported - was gushing all over him in desperate agreement like he was the Delphic Oracle.

If Keane was an expensive foreign import, Rafa would be getting hammered for playing him as much as he has done. Everyone points out that he was 'dropped' after scoring twice..apart from the obvious retort that the TEAM won the subsequent game 5-1, the match was less than 48 hours later, and plenty of others were rested - Alonso and Riera were also in good form and didn't play; it was an understandable and effective piece of rotation. It's not like he didn't get a chance to play again soon -the Preston game was only the next weekend after Bolton. Alonso, Riera - impressive, effective, productive; Robbie woeful. Next game? Well, not playing the formation, and in the main the players, that did so well in the previous league game could be construed as tinkering, so I don't know why it's such an affront that Keane didn't play; OK, we stank, but at least he got to start in the biggest game of the month! Everton at Anfield,the perfect chance for a Reds fan to...not even turn up. Now Rafa is getting stick for not bringing him on for Torres at Wigan, instead bringing on a 'midfielder'. Torres was gone, that was clear, but moving Babel up meant we kept the identical shape in a game we were, at the time, cruising. Robbie couldn't be expected to play the lone, tall, strong, pacy striker, at least Babel has the attributes (and there is little to choose in poverty of performance between Babel and Keane recently), so we would have had to have shifted around the team to accomodate him - maybe moving Gerrard from his position. Yet that option - tinkering - is presented as the rational one whereas moving Babel in there is dismissed as 'ridiculous'. I like Keane, want him to stay and flourish, and think he has a lot to offer. But he has been getting the chances, and simply has not done anywhere near enough to justify the clamour and attention that has surrounded his not being selected.

I think there's a crucial point underlying this. There is an oft-repeated claim made that we will never win the league under Rafa, which people justify by various means (nature of La Liga vs PL, etc.), most of which I find unconvincing, although I don't deny that such an argument could possibly be made. A corollary requirment is to either diminish, demean or effrectively ignore his European record or construct a similar, usually one-dimensional argument as to why Rafa's style works in Europe or cups only. In some instances, European success is used as proof positive that he cannot win the League. Many of these arguments have become mantra-like received wisdom. For me, what you need to win the league from the manager is a range of qualities - tactics, coaching, psychology, intellect, conviction, flexibility - etc. Whilst European and cup football (and we are only in one League competition, so any other success has to be 'cup' football) do require some things to be slightly different, I remain to be convinced that a manager and team who can succeed in them - especially Europe - cannot, almost by definition, succeed in the League. I know it's the thing we most want, but the pre-requisite is a manager of high quality, and his other (non-PL) successes to date, and any more he and we may acheive (whatever the naysayers - especially non-Reds - may say) still mark him out as such a manager. (Even if he is having a mare at the moment).

True, but there is no suggestion that Rafa's subsequent change of mind to go 3-5-2 with Didi coming in and surround Pirlo was due to Finnan's injury; Cisse replacing Traore would still have meant 3 at the back, and could have still been deployed whichever Full Back stayed on

i mean in general there have been so many games this season we havent looked arsed til we went behind If by in general, you mean by ignoring those instances which don't fit the conclusion, I'd agree. Truth be told, any team once behind has to adjust in one way or another (depending on how late in the game it is), so it's something of a truism. I'd be severely p*ssed off if our reaction to going behind, or being behind with a few minutes left, was to throw the towel in and give up. To extend the answer, I was quite impressed with those games - Blackburn, Bolton - where we exerted 'control' before finally forcing an almost inevitable advantage. In neither of those did we really cut loose and play fantastically, but there was a determination and conviction about us which was vindicated by the result.

Not really - Rafa told Traore to get dressed for Didi to come on, but had to change when told Finnan couldn't carry on; so either way, a Full-back off and 3 at the back.

Our best football this season was at Newcastle when we were never behind, or Spurs where we fell away after they equalised. So, no.