abc

He was so bad Rafa took him off very quickly after the start of the second half. The way he gave the ball away showed he was way out of his depth tonight.

People were screaming for Rafa to start his best players at Portsmouth a few weekends ago, and rest players against Porto. Tonight it seems like he's saved some of his team for the weekend. If he was indeed resting some players (Arbeloa, Mascherano, Kuyt, Riise) for Saturday, then you'll have no complaints from me. Whether or not he needs to be resting them, that's for another thread...

Toure is 5'10". Gallas is not much taller. Senderos by admission of some Arsenal fans is very inconsistent. Their stand in centreback Gilberto is about Toure's height as well. Last year Peter Crouch was excellent against Arsenal at Anfield. He scored a hattrick. Peter Crouch is 6'7". Therefore Peter Crouch will start against Arsenal. I think. Hopefully with Torres. Mascherano and Alonso in the middle. Gerrard and someone else (Babel) out wide.

I still maintain that the team and Rafa's performances against the big clubs away from home will indicate whether we win the league this season. Houllier in his 5 or so seasons had gone to Arsenal, Chelsea and Man Utd and come away with a win at least once. Rafa in his 3 so far has yet to come away with a point. And in all our performances in the last three season, I can only think of Chelsea last season and Man Utd the previous one where we played well enough to deserve anything. Looking at the fixture list, we need to get a lot of points from the first half of the season because it seems like our traditionally difficult matches are going to be in the later part of the season - we're playing Chelsea, Man Utd, Bolton, City, Spurs and Arsenal away in the last 12 fixtures or so. Fulham seems to be a place where we haven't done too well in the past years too. Last season the fixture list at the start was really tough, and a mixture of everything (confidence being a key factor) hampered our away form. This season, we've had a reasonable fixture list at the beginning of the season. And we really need to build confidence and momentum like Man Utd did last season, and also like Arsenal are seeming to do with this one...

If you really believe he's criminally overrated, then you are the biggest muppet on these boards. In 6 league games this season, he's provided for six goals and scored four of his own. Not only that, he is the star player of his team at 20 years old, stepped up to the challenge after Henry left, and has shouldered that respobsibility incredibly well.

What a sensationalist (read knee jerker)... On the other hand, I like Marcel Desailly...good analysis, and came across as unbiased as can be having been a former Chelsea player. Hansen was embarassing to put it mildly...

They'll "do it for the gaffa" for a couple matches and then

I thought Townsend was very nice about our performance, saying that sometimes things don't go for you for a number of reasons. Didn't slate us at all. Almost making excuses for a poor showing in fact.

I remember being very impressed with Crouchy's all round play in his first season. At times, his ball control and use was world class. The way he set up plays, and linked with Gerrard especially was very good. Only problem was his goalscoring contribution (none in 18/19 didn't help an afterwards decent record). Last season he started scoring more goals, but it seemed to me the rest of his game didn't go so well. In the past months (incl last season), his touch and use of the ball looked very average - maybe he's still playing at that level but our standards have lifted and expectations are higher.

I think unless you watch a lot of games featuring a certain player, there's no way you can form a solid (and valid) opinion of their strengths and weaknesses.

Thought he covered the backline very well. In the first half he made two important interceptions, both of which were subsequently highlighted by the MOTD crew. As for Gerrard, I was watching closely, he was not too involved in the moves in the first 20 minutes. In the second half he saw more of the ball, and there was more space for him to attack. Defo not as influential for England as he is for us, even with the license to play further forward.

I thought Gareth Barry was the key difference between the sh*te performances in the past and the two solid free flowing football played this past week. Kept play ticking along, tracked back well, and was in the thick of all the good moves. Overshadowed Gerrard tonight I thought. It's obvious to the layman - Lampard always gets ahead of the play, which is a good attribute in itself, and Gerrard isn't the type of player who plays short passes to keep things rolling which is why the Lampard-Gerrard midfield will NEVER work. And also why Alonso is so important to our play - he allows Stevie to play his game, yet keeps our passing ticking along. Stevie in England colours seldom seems like the same player he is for us. I might have been watching a different match, but I thought he was not in the game for the first 20 minutes. Maybe his presence alone was pulling markers towards him which freed space for other players. Certainly all the hype about Gerrard being so important to England's hopes were overplayed. Which turned out to be a great thing for Liverpool - as someone mentioned, he got more match fitness.

My pick as well. I'd actually have Alonso ahead of Finnan too. Kuyt would also defo relish in the role.

We played reasonably against Everton and Bolton (until the stupid lino decided to give a free kick due to a horrible misjudgement). We didn't do too badly against Chelsea too. Against Man Utd we were horrible, and only very slightly better against Arsenal. Our record at home was pretty damn good even during the period which we couldn't win away. Rafa got it all wrong with his approach too, which didn't help.

2 words - momentum and confidence.

Luck plays a huge part - Man Utd hardly had any serious injuries last season. And our squad was stronger than theirs even then. Yet we still finished miles behind. Having a horribly difficult fixture list at the start of last year just made it more difficult.

Even Rafa said Carra's hand moved slightly towards the ball and could understand why it was given.

With all due respect, that's nonsense. Even last season we trashed Wigan, beat Reading and the Pompey game was meaningless. The real litmus test is going away to Man Utd, Chelsea and Arsenal - hold our own and get the results. Last season we were decent for 15 minutes at Old Trafford, 30 at the Emirates and alot of the game at Stamford Bridge (against 10 for most of the 2nd half mind you). The season we racked up 81 points, we were poor at Chelsea, barely better at Arsenal, and dominant but toothless at Man Utd. This season we will do much better away to the top teams because of one key factor - the addition of pacy and skilful forward players (Torres, Babel, Voronin).

More telling is one was from an uncharacteristic loss of concentration by Carra, the other was a 'phantom' penalty.

To be fair to GH (I'm not a fan of his), I think his initial idea was to get the team playing with the tucked in midfield, with width coming from the full backs. Hence the acquisitions of Ziege and Babbel.

Out of Crouch and Kuyt, as the center forward it's Crouchy for me every time. I was thinking more in terms of how the team would benefit from Yossi's movement playing off Crouch, more so than Crouchy and Benayoun linking up to score goals. If that makes any sense at all.

Not being cheeky or nowt, but he did play at center back for parts of that game.

I'd love to see him play behind Torres or Crouch.

The passage of play where he was fed the ball down the right and then rolled the ball past the Sunderland left back with ease, cut back the ball for Voronin (who shot it straight at Gordon), was pure class. It was as if the defender had no clue whatsoever of what Torres could and wanted to do.

But the season prior in which we amassed 81 points, we won a lot of our away games against the smaller teams, Sunderland being one of them... I don't like the whole "last season we would have..." being used as an indicator of our progress. When we go to Chelsea/Arsenal/Man Utd and put in strong performances and come away with results, while keeping the consistency against the smaller teams, then that would be a sign of progress IMO.