Logic

He was a goner because our team would take revenge (look at the treatment Pienaar got at every opportunity after his assault on El Jefecito). He didn't have the balls needed to step onto the field again. If he was getting a red he would have got it while being carried from the field. He never got injured, he's simply a coward.

That's terrible. Straight red card that kick to Kuyt's head.

From the BBC Do they even watch the game? Why no comment about Fellaini's assault on Sotiris?

That tackle is a possible career-ender. He should be charged as the ref obviously "didn't see it". And I missed the kick. Was it intentional? And does anyone have a video of it?

Like I said before, I'm pretty sure he didn't get injured. He simply knew what was coming if he'd step onto the field again and chickened out from getting back into the action. A cowards tackle, and a cowards behavior after it.

Are you sure he's injured? I think he knew what was coming if he'd return to the field and chickened out.

This O.G. is probably the signing of the season. Just ahead of the Referees association.

Highlights: Kuyt's goal obviously. Stevie's revenge "tackle" on bitter with braids. Sotiris showing how to be a man after horror tackle by getting up and walking off the field. Afro-dude showing the complete lack of balls required to step onto the field again. To quote Borat. S'nice, high 5!

s*** defending by Insua.... But we have Pepe.

The ref has no idea what he's doing.

view straight on, but with two players probably on either side of the tackle. ----------tackle Bitter---------Lucas(?) ---------c*** Great description aye?

I love Kuyt.

Is there any ref that doesn't make high profile "mistakes" against us anymore? about 10-15m away. Not more.

He most likely didn't have the balls to step onto the field again. No way was he injured from that.

It will be appealed and rescinded. No doubt about it. (But the moment I say that I realise I'm talking about the FA here...)

It's a straight red for both Pienaar and Fellaini. The greek went fairly in for the tackle.

Afro-dude should be off! But he sends Kyrgiakos off! WTF!?!?!?!??!?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/manchester/8494432.stm

That's the thing that irritates me the most. Seeing the set up and players chosen results like this and more importantly performances like this are to be expected. We are set up to be "safe". We are set up to keep a clean sheet and rely on the individual brilliance of Torres or Stevie G. That might work when both are on fire but Torres seems to be chronically injured and Stevie G looks half the player he was last season. Then a set up like this results in something like we saw today. This shouldn't surprise people. We need to put out a team that scares the opposition because it is obvious we believe we will win. Not put out a team that tells the opposition that we are hoping for an individual to pull some magic off. We need a change from the top down. And we need it soon.

Agree, keep him in the team for the next game. Finally someone who can head the ball.

How far we have fallen. "We stopped them playing"? It's f*cking Stoke! And our f*cking job shouldn't be to "stop them playing"! We played 6 defenders and two holding midfielders against them. We took off a forward to put on a midfielder to hold onto the lead. I love Rafa but this isn't working out. This whole thing about "we need to work harder and train better" is BS. Maybe all the hard work is making us mentally and physically tired? We need to put on a team that tells the opponent that they will be attacked until the end of the game. Liverpool should NEVER set up a team to defend against a team like Stoke. If we accept that we can forget about fighting for the title and we can forget about being a "top 4" team. If we put on 8 defensive players and rely on a bit of individual brilliance from Stevie G and Torres (when they are fit) then we are destined for mediocrity. I hate this because I've been (and still am) a fan of Rafa. But TLW is not about putting on 8 defensive players against Stoke.

how long is it since we won something? Play the best available XI and keep 3 youngsters like pacheco et al on the bench. we live to win trophies. this is the biggest available one.

"There was the back four plus Javier Mascherano, Lucas and Emiliano Insua, normally a left-back, playing in midfield." http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/8428085.stm

BBQ with drinks and strippers perhaps?