Logic

I burst out laughing when I saw that. Still think a foul like that has to be a red.

It was Duncan Alexander who is head of content and media for Opta that posted it so I'm guessing it's correct.

I know this is the Referees and LFC thread but I still think it's worth to point out the treatment the Mancs get from the refs. So here's more: http://diminbeirut.typepad.com/my-blog/2012/10/corruption-and-influence-peddling-in-the-english-game.html

More: PL penalties taken by club in 2012: Man Utd 11, Man City 6, Chelsea 4, Liverpool 2, Tottenham 2, Arsenal 1.

Opta ‏@OptaJoe 3 - Three of the six players to win more than one penalty in the PL in 2012 play for Man Utd (Welbeck 3, Young 3, Valencia 2). Spotted. So... interesting trend developing (although already obvious to most). And how many of those penalties were dives?

I don't think it's just in your country. Journalists have been replaced everywhere with Churnalists who think choosing a few soundbites from a PR statement is journalism. There are no follow-up questions, no independent investigations, no criticism, no nothing. The 4th estate is broken. Just like the rest.

Is soccernet the only ones who've dealt with this? And do reporters no longer do follow up questions? Only ask for a comment and that's it? Questions like: How is the rotation decided? Can we see the rota system or how it works? On average how often do referees get lower league games? etc etc

Our game vs. West Brom? From what I can remember they seem to have it pretty correct. That's keeping in mind that close calls are given as correct by them. The frustration because of the penalties was IMO mostly because we never see such calls being made in our favour rather than them being wrong.

Calciopoli was largely about teams controlling which refs they'd (or their competitors) get. That obviously does not happen in the PL... For more: http://www.refereedecisions.co.uk/how-the-refs-treated-man-u-last-season/

It is. Still think a professional footballer should not look tired after half an our of football. Hopefully he's just unfit after being out injured for a while.

30min in and Cole seems to be tired already... not a good sign that.

Ignoring what a c*nt Poll is that article highlights something that should be very worrying for not just us, but almost every team in the league. Here we have a former "elite" ref using the words of a competing teams manager as an argument for not awarding a player the correct decisions. We should highlight this and demand an official reply from Manc Riley denouncing this sort of thinking. And we should do it very publicly and noticeably. Poll's word imply there's corruption in the game and the PGMOL, the FA and other teams should come out strongly against this kind of thinking.

If true about Downing being last in - first out when it comes to training the same should apply about him getting in the team. He should only play if we have no one else to fill the required role. And we have a bunch of exciting youngsters coming through the ranks meaning Downing shouldn't start this game. So Epic Swindle's team and switching Downing for Jonjo/Cole/Ngoo/Morgan/etc and shift players around as needed in the 4-3-3.

My thinking goes as follows; the amount of non-decisions in a game is too much to track but in theory they should have the same rate of for/against as the decisions the ref actually makes. So only focusing on decisions the ref makes both limits the amount of decisions to count and should also limit any bias, as such that we forget about decisions that went for us. I realise I've put way too much thought into this:bleh:

Just realised I shouldn't include that incident... nothing given for or against so we're still at 0-5.

West Brom Penalty nr 1. Debatable decision gone against us. Penalty nr 2. Debatable decision gone against us. Man City: None Arsenal None Sunderland Suarez penalty claim: Decision made to book instead of giving the penalty - gone against us. ManU Shelvey sent off: Debatable decision gone against us. Manc penalty: Debatable decision gone against us. Norwich Suarez penalty claim: Not even debatable. Clear penalty that wasn't given. Am I forgetting anything for and against? So far we are 0-6 when it comes to these decisions. Theory nr two: Suarez has an unfair reputation for diving: Well... Should have had a penalty again. Nothing so far clear showing he's a diver.

Wasn't it impossible to appeal the verdict? Only the length of the ban could be challenged in an appeal IIRC from the whole Suarez/Evra saga.

Guardian implying that we will start cheating to get decisions and espn going with "Brendan Rodgers has called refs' chief Mike Riley to tell him that, as a big club, Liverpool should get more decisions." Great...

Also interesting that Rodgers said the referee assessors haven't yet called him after the Utd game.

Interesting that Cobs, thanks for pointing it out.

Yup, no aimless running around like you'd sort of expect from someone as young as him. From what I've seen of him he looks a very good prospect. Future is bright.

Another thing that impressed me in that goal is the movement by young Sinclair. First runs across the centreback who could/should step out to meet Suso then pulls the fullback away from Assaidi and gets back into a position to finish off the move if the ball comes to him.

Coates is right footed.

Our last two managers then.

Exactly. You need to use the first high profile incident in the game to get a bit of control over the ref. It might not be good sportsmanship but while other teams do it we need to be better at it than them. Same with diving or pretending to be injured. The mancs were able to 1) take a time-out of sorts simulating an injury (Rio after about 20min), 2) get a player sent off (Evans pretending to be badly hurt and 3) win a penalty by diving. And as I said, we need to be better than them at everything and that includes what is normally considered cheating. Yup, we need Brendan to use the next pre-game PCs to hammer home the message that Suarez doesn't get a penalty if he's hacked down and so on and so forth. If the media doesn't like it... well then they aren't invited to the next PC or player interviews.