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Alonso or Lucas?


mooks

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After the Arsenal tie, I suggested Lucas should replace Xabi in the semi-final matches. I see most of us had Lucas in the top 3 today and he also did well in the second half against Blackburn.

 

Alonso was once again abysmal in his brief performance, nearly giving away a goal and being caught in possession on at least two other occasions.

 

While Lucas still has a way to go and may never have the physique to be an automatic first choice in our team, he is deceptively good at breaking up play by sticking his foot in. He shows excellent awareness in the last third - something which has deserted Alonso for two years now. He complements Mascherano extremely well and had a good game at Stamford Bridge earlier this year. He didn't dwell on the ball at all against Fulham and is a natural at keeping the ball moving quickly and intelligently.

 

About the only area I can think of in which Alonso is better than him is at pinging 40 yard balls out to the wings to change the direction of play - not a bad arrow to have in your quiver but one which hardly makes up for his other shortcomings.

 

So who to start on Tuesday - Alonso or Lucas?

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Alonso. Everytime

 

Lucas has done ok against teams that give time and space. He wont get that against Chelsea. And while Alonso is in terminal poor form i'd still back him to put in a good performance more than i would Lucas

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Alonso. Everytime

 

Lucas has done ok against teams that give time and space. He wont get that against Chelsea. And while Alonso is in terminal poor form i'd still back him to put in a good performance more than i would Lucas

 

Agree

 

Although Alonso really needs to wake up a bit. Constantly spending too long on the ball and losing it in dangerous positions.

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Alonso. Lucas' game is a bit similar to Mascherano's - Alonso is something very different..it's not just the accurate longer balls but the vision to see things on or happening that others either miss or can't make happen even if they do see them - and then make the pass.

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Guest KopiteChris

Alonso wins it for me every time.

 

Although I agree with some of the posts on here that as of late Xabi has let his game slip a little but at the moment. Been very impresed with what Lucas has done but he is still very young and i dont think that he is ready for such a big game. I hope that he is if needed and rekon he has a big future with liverpool!!

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Alonso. Lucas' game is a bit similar to Mascherano's - Alonso is something very different..it's not just the accurate longer balls but the vision to see things on or happening that others either miss or can't make happen even if they do see them - and then make the pass.

With respect, I'd rather have another Mascherano than another Alonso recently - if you know what I mean

 

Lucas' link-up play in and around the box was top-class yesterday - exactly what we will need to open up Chelsea on Tuesday.

 

Alonso wins it for me every time.

 

Although I agree with some of the posts on here that as of late Xabi has let his game slip a little but at the moment. Been very impresed with what Lucas has done but he is still very young and i dont think that he is ready for such a big game. I hope that he is if needed and rekon he has a big future with liverpool!!

The same Lucas who started both legs against Inter?

 

The way I see it there are two question marks for Tuesday:

- Crouch/Babel

- Alonso/Lucas/Pennant

 

Crouch/Babel is simple enough and is the difference between the Arsenal first leg and second leg teams. Reasons Crouch may be preferred are: he is scoring goals, the team formation and shape has not been consistent in recent games anyway, Chelsea are without Essien and Makelele (who is not an offensive threat anyway) is apparently on his last legs so we are less likely to be overrun in midfield if we go 4-4-2, and Babel is far more effective as a substitute.

 

Alonso/Lucas is also straight forward and is the difference between the Inter Milan and Arsenal (first leg) teams.

 

Pennant could have played himself into contention with his end product and work rate yesterday. He could play in place of Babel in a 4-5-1 (with Babel coming on as sub) or could play in a 4-4-2 with Mascherano and Gerrard in the middle.

 

Options, options :)

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I think Alonso has improved a bit from a couple of weeks ago.

Aye, quite a few had him in their top 3 against Blackburn

 

Thought he was the epitome of averageness in that game myself. Certainly no better than Lucas.

 

But then the two of them don't make a natural pairing so the real factor is how either performs with Masch and Stevie.

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After the Arsenal tie, I suggested Lucas should replace Xabi in the semi-final matches. I see most of us had Lucas in the top 3 today and he also did well in the second half against Blackburn.

 

Alonso was once again abysmal in his brief performance, nearly giving away a goal and being caught in possession on at least two other occasions.

 

While Lucas still has a way to go and may never have the physique to be an automatic first choice in our team, he is deceptively good at breaking up play by sticking his foot in. He shows excellent awareness in the last third - something which has deserted Alonso for two years now. He complements Mascherano extremely well and had a good game at Stamford Bridge earlier this year. He didn't dwell on the ball at all against Fulham and is a natural at keeping the ball moving quickly and intelligently.

 

About the only area I can think of in which Alonso is better than him is at pinging 40 yard balls out to the wings to change the direction of play - not a bad arrow to have in your quiver but one which hardly makes up for his other shortcomings.

 

So who to start on Tuesday - Alonso or Lucas?

 

 

Excellent points well made. Rafa might just surprise us

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Alonso.

 

Lucas looks decent enough when we have the ball but is a bit lightweight when a battle attitude is called for. Plus Xabi has that knack of pulling off a killer pass that ends up in a goal. Lucas will get enough chances when he beefs up a bit and gathers his experience in lesser games.

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Alonso.

 

Lucas looks decent enough when we have the ball but is a bit lightweight when a battle attitude is called for. Plus Xabi has that knack of pulling off a killer pass that ends up in a goal. Lucas will get enough chances when he beefs up a bit and gathers his experience in lesser games.

 

In mitigation, Lucas has 3 assists in 9 starts (should have been 4 if Benayoun AKA the invisible man, didn't miss a sitter yesterday)

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In mitigation, Lucas has 3 assists in 9 starts (should have been 4 if Benayoun AKA the invisible man, didn't miss a sitter yesterday)

 

Like i said, he looks good when we have a lot of the ball against lesser teams. No disrespect but i just think Xabi is the better option for this particular game.

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Guest Prongsy

I like Lucas, I've defended him against kneejerkers that won't give him two minutes to settle and I also think He'll be superb in years to come. However, Alonso has played in Two European cup finals, 3 (i think) semi final legs, at a world cup, fa cup final...

 

He's the most experienced and you can't pick Lucas ahead of him for this game, it'd be crazy.

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Being honest, I think Xabi will start

 

It's a bit like Kuyt, he's been s***e for most of the season but excellent for the last month. Now Pennants back on the scene and had one good game against a Fulham team who were s***e. If he got the nod ahead of Kuyt for Tuesday it would raise quite a few eyebrows and it would be a wrong decision personally. Xabi has had an average season by his standards, but he'll be up for this game because of his experience. I like the lad Lucas, but in a game of this magnitude it would be unfair to throw the lad in imo.

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It's a bit like Kuyt, he's been s***e for most of the season but excellent for the last month. Now Pennants back on the scene and had one good game against a Fulham team who were s***e. If he got the nod ahead of Kuyt for Tuesday it would raise quite a few eyebrows and it would be a wrong decision personally. Xabi has had an average season by his standards, but he'll be up for this game because of his experience. I like the lad Lucas, but in a game of this magnitude it would be unfair to throw the lad in imo.

 

I think Xabi should and will start. But that is purely down to his experience.

 

I made a post a few months back that I think Xabi should be moved on, and I still stick by that several months later, nothing has persuaded me otherwise.

 

It's nothing personal, he's a great pro and has played an important role for us as times, but for me he's not cut out for the hustle and bustle of the Premiership. He is a typical 'European player' who craves time and space on the ball. But against physical and fast teams who close us down quickly, he is lost. Against Arsenal I thought he was a liability, often getting caught in possession and really struggling with Arsenal's quick movement in the final third. I think he may find it a bit easier against Chelsea as they don't play with the same intensity as Arsenal but he'll still struggle more than he would against a typical European side.

 

I think Xabi will be a roraring success back in Spain or Italy. We'd still get good money for him now too. I know he's not everyones cup of tea, but think someone like Barry would be an ideal replacement in terms of a Premiership title challenge. He's a bit more agile than Xabi, is not easily brished off the ball, but will offer a bit more going forward too. Just my opinion like......

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I think Xabi should and will start. But that is purely down to his experience.

 

I made a post a few months back that I think Xabi should be moved on, and I still stick by that several months later, nothing has persuaded me otherwise.

 

It's nothing personal, he's a great pro and has played an important role for us as times, but for me he's not cut out for the hustle and bustle of the Premiership. He is a typical 'European player' who craves time and space on the ball. But against physical and fast teams who close us down quickly, he is lost. Against Arsenal I thought he was a liability, often getting caught in possession and really struggling with Arsenal's quick movement in the final third. I think he may find it a bit easier against Chelsea as they don't play with the same intensity as Arsenal but he'll still struggle more than he would against a typical European side.

 

I think Xabi will be a roraring success back in Spain or Italy. We'd still get good money for him now too. I know he's not everyones cup of tea, but think someone like Barry would be an ideal replacement in terms of a Premiership title challenge. He's a bit more agile than Xabi, is not easily brished off the ball, but will offer a bit more going forward too. Just my opinion like......

I know where you're coming from but I only think the game has looked to quick for him lately. He's a brilliant player who makes time for himself on the ball and is not afraid to mix it up at all. Thing is lately those two things seem to be missing. Either his head is somewhere else or he's still injured.

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Guest KopiteChris

QUOTE(KopiteChris @ Apr 20 2008, 05:23)

Alonso wins it for me every time.

 

Although I agree with some of the posts on here that as of late Xabi has let his game slip a little but at the moment. Been very impresed with what Lucas has done but he is still very young and i dont think that he is ready for such a big game. I hope that he is if needed and rekon he has a big future with liverpool!!

 

The same Lucas who started both legs against Inter?

 

 

Very good point but my feeling is that this game is so much bigger not only as its a CL semi Final but who were up against.

 

Lose to Inter and its well we lost to the Italian Champs but lose to Chelski then its a bitter pill to swollow.

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Guest Beano's Dad

I like the Babel on the left option with Xabi/Mash/Stevie in the middle and Dirk out on the right.

 

Problem with Crouch is that v Chelsea he gets owned by Terry and Carvalho every time. He also gets in the way of Torres and tends to draw defenders back into the middle meaning Torres goes back out wide right. This was the case v Arsenal in the first half of the 2nd leg. No wonder we looked lost.

 

Play PC up front second leg perhaps with Babel on the bench but I would start Babel on Tuesday. Perhaps why he did not play yesterday. We need to attack on Tuesday and for once I actually think a 2-1 at home would be OK as I don't think this Chavs side could take us 1-0 in a second leg.

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