Archangel

Not a bad analogy from what i've heard but if he should sign lets give him a chance eh

What part of there's more to mounting a title challenge than participating in a merry go round of player transfers do you not understand Sorry if I'm obtuse but so is the original posters premise. Fact is Benitez has been allowed to bring in the likes of Torres, Mascherano, Keane, Skrtel and Dossena straight into the first team mostly his choice, then the likes of Benayoun, Penant, Voronin to pad out the squad who could be said to make do's and Babel, Ngog and Levia and a host of other young talent for the future. Add to that the huge increases in salaries given to key players (including Alonso) at the start of last season and it all seems rather churlish to me to make a song and dance about Rafa not being backed and ''having to make do'' We can all dream of being able to throw money at other clubs for their players but even we have limits I wonder have those people who have blamed the board for not allowing Benitez to throw money at the problem actually considered perhaps that its Benitez who has held back because quite frankly some of the recent valuations have been ludricrous and the fact that he has refrained from extravagance is actually in our longer term interests or shall we just take the simpleton route and see it as a reason to bash the owners

I think its fair to say that the Arabs appear to be very genuine in their desire to own us specifically, if it was simply an investment alone that they were interested in, arguably there are several other potential opportunities they could have gone for in the premier league alone, Everton for example, who also need to build a stadium Newcastle or even Tottenham both of whose owners have indicated a willingness to sell up at some point. I dont doubt the Arabs intent, I just dont feel confident that ownership under them will be quite as wonderful as some people obviously are hoping for.

There's a lot more to ''mounting a title challenge'' than just participating in an endless merry-go-round of player transfers as for spending Benitez has had a fair crack over the last couple of summers and we desperately need to be closer. At this particular moment in time we are more dysfunctional than ever - things should improve but dont make out a case that the manager has not been backed. Maybe a winger should have been a priority from 1st july

He's spot on What great Liverpool sides always did in the past when it was necessary

His pursuit of Barry throughout the summer perhaps, being the most recent example perhaps. Incidentally, not necessarily a bad thing if you trust his judgement implicitly

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They own the club so they are entitled to have some say in how its managed I'd agree with you in a perfect world scenario, but you seem to forget that these guys are investors not fans and although they employ a manager they'd still need to be convinced that he is using their money wisely I'm speculating here but it would not particularly surprise me if the americans were getting a second opinion from another source other than relying completely on Benitez It would explain why the manager feels so undermined and in that sense I admire him for fighting his corner, just very unsure about him doing it now and in public, also in that he cant possibly win

I have problems with the boycott issue as I've mentioned elsewhere The s*n boycott, I understand and actively pursue even to the point of making my feelings known to the people in the office who read it, not that they care greatly - but thats their problem However, the shirt is somewhat different, to me it symbalizes the club I'm proud of and have supported through the years its an emotional tie in, I cant refuse my lad something I've always had Sorry, part of me understands the sentiment but I think its hitting the wrong target

Perhaps you misunderstand so I'll try to clarify and then let it lie I dont believe I've ever said that it was ok for the americans to indulge in gamesmanship, I said they lie, accept it, which is different - there are things like this you cant change As for Benitez, ok, he can continue as he is if you like, but I happen to believe that he has a closer involvement with the players and his responsibility is to them not to playing politics with the management I could be wrong, I'm not going to toss my dummy out the pram over it, but there's always another view

Sarcasm and abuse - not the greatest debating technique Whether its temperament or strategy or both, the effect is just the same. I dont know why Benitez feels he has to get involved so publically and at this time. Perhaps it is frustration but he's fuelling the conflict when he needs to be concentrating on getting our season up and running. I believe he played a similar game last year and got Hicks backing (eventually) but to repeat the tactic again is distinctly risky for his own future. It could seriously backfire on him personally if we dont get off to a flying start By the way, thats just an opinion, not a fact .... just for those who find the distinctions difficult

Sorry I'm a bit lost here, whats your point To clarify I was indicating that I didnt like the way Benitez used the press conferance to publically reopen his spat with Parry, or so I thought

Can we get over this ''the owners lied'' rubbish. They did, so what, its what businessmen do. Anyone who believes that investors make their wealth by acting like Mother Theresa need to take a grip Its not the first time, it wont be the last, so to prevent future disappointment and self appointed outrage - get with the program

Who am i? what do I want? I'm a Liverpool supporter of forty odd years standing, I've seen great managers and great players in that time and some not so great. What do I want? probably the same as you. I'm not putting the knife in Rafa's back, to a certain extent he is doing that himself, but I certainly dont hold the manager with the unquestioning esteem that many others do. He is a good manager tactically, shrewd and focused certainly, obstinate undoubtedly, but on the field he now needs to deliver a credible side that challenges for the title and that also means keeping out of the boardroom battles that go on off it. I cant be sure, but I cant imagine those great managers of the past kicking off in front of the media like he has done recently and last year, although to be fair circumstances have changed As for the owners they cant work together even when they are on speaking terms, so we get this infighting which is what will really damage the clubs future. Forget the lies they told (that will happen with any owner, including DIC) forget the klinsmann affair (Moores was guilty of the same) forget the chaos of the stadium build - those can be overcome, but the Americans need to sort out who runs the club as they both evidently cant And your views, the boycotts, the marches, and all that? No, dont see it getting anywhere. We have legitimate owners of the club who will not relinquish that ownership easily. Why should they, owning a great club like Liverpool and having the potential to make money at the same time must be a great aphrodisiac for them. To be honest only a boycott that seriously undermined the club's profitability would encourage them to go and if we ever acheived that point we'd risk destroying the very thing we wanted to protect - thats why I'm not onside with that strategy I dont know what motivated you to question my posts - I can only guess, but my position is genuine enough, I want to see a return to the days when we were real league contenders but I cant see that happening if there is a poisonous atmosphere at the senior management level and quite honestly I would prefer Rafa to stay out of that and let Parry cut his own throat

As we are into role definition then the Manager should manage coach and train, not brief journalists such as Balague to fight their internal power battles for them God knows I believe that Parry has been out of his depth for some time in managing the affairs of this club but to excuse Benitez for his public outbursts in full glare of the media hours before our first game of the season is not something I agree with and even more peverse, to put all the blame on the owners is ludicrous Benitez is playing a very dangerous game of brinksmanship, briefing one story through his friends and contacts, then publicly disowning the comments later, after they've had their impact. This happened last year and I'm beginning to lose sympathy for the manager if he believes this is the way to play the game And as for the Barry saga, do we simply accept that if the manager wants a player we get him regardless of the circumstances, I mean, the prospect of selling alonso and replacing him with barry + cash/finnan is worthy of being challenged surely and maybe, on this particular occasion Parry was right to caution the wisdom of spending money on Barry

At this stage of the season any win is a good win, players are still a bit rusty, new players come in and have to gel, but if we are still lethargic and dysfunctional in a few weeks time then thats going to be a bit more concerning. As an isolated result the poor performance can be overlooked, the three points are the thing to build upon

The relationship with Alonso is certainly puzzling, Benitez says he is happy with him but then acts like he is surplus to requirement. Not at all disimilar to the treatment of Peter Crouch last season

This is clearly where the damage is being done to the club, its not the finance as some believe, its not the stadium, its the posturing by senior management. It'll harm the club, it'll certainly handicap us this season if it continues. If its necessary to do it in public obviously only Benitez knows but from the little I see and know Its not something I like to see at Liverpool. Benitez is playing with fire - he's got Hicks' commitment but I dont think that extends to Gillett and where would DIC stand with a manager so comfortable with making public such sharp disagreements within the club - second time around the papers have been filled with veiled threats as well - not that professional imo actually I'm beginning to get fed up with Benitez maybe he should concentrate on coaching

The issues about the americans remain for me Its not about transfer money, its not about how long they are taking to build the stadium, its simply that they do not get on, in fact they cant bear each other, thats what will be damaging to this club The stadium will be built, the funding will be found, the manager will be supported, but divisions will remain at board level, mix that with big egos and you get a recipe for paralysis Unless they sort out that s*** we will continue to suffer

I know i'm going to regret asking this but do you really believe hicks is paying people to trawl through internet forums to post pro hicks propaganda? I mean do really think the american cares? is the internet that powerful?

The signing of keane and the potential signing of barry is an interesting move by benitez and shows one strength he certainly has which is balls. We have, or in barry's case. will have paid over the odds for both players but thats what the market demands when you take an aggressive stance over key players from your rivals Its not a gamble in any way as he is investing in proven quality, but the circumstances are that such a bold move bears his stamp and if we fail next season to make a credible challenge, that is, not one which is over in February, then there will be no running, no excuses and honestly i dont think it would matter who owned us, the consequences would be the same FWIW there's a few things that concern me about his philosophies and the way he insists on micro managing the squad, but he's certainly not afraid to make his mark and if it should pay off this season, not only fair play to him, but in my eyes he will truly deserve to be considered one of the great managers of this club That is, obviously, a big if at the moment

Accomodating players at the expense of employing the right system is not a mistake i could see benitez making Accomodating both barry and alonso in the midfield forgoing one transfer fee and paying both players wages at the same time for marginal benefits is equally unlikely I still cant see how we can keep the two, there appears to be alot of wishfull thinking going on - we are not yet chelsea

OK I give up.......

We can argue about this to the cows come home and get nowhere, we are clearly at opposite ends of the spectrum though I genuinely cant see why? For me we expressed an interest, failed and then set about subtlely or not so subtley applying pressure to force O'Neils hand. The rights/wrongs of that these days are another issue but I see O'Neils reaction as perfectly justified in the light of events. To use his behaviour to disrespect and belittle him is petty and fundamentally flawed. I've followed O'Neils career for awhile and he is a clever resourceful perceptive guy who maximises the limitations of his squad - not a 100% different from the job Benitez has to do at Anfield.

When he hits form he can be as good as a wide player can be, but he's young still lacking experience as a player and inconsistent. Its been a problem for him because when he's been poor fans have slagged him off as a favorite of McClaren but he does have plenty of natural talent. He would improve with better players around him and if he played more in Europe. If the rumours which say that he's a target for us are true I assume its because Benitez believes he's worth taking a gamble on.