Dave Mackay

[John am Rhein]

I've just been reading about what a great player he was, Can anyone remember him? (I'm not quite THAT old)

 

And also he was a League Championship winning manager with Derby and then seemed to virtually disappear - what happened there?

[Gunga Din]

he got the boot from derby a couple of seasons after he won the league and then went off to manage in the middle east for ages. i think, although i'm not certain, he may ave managed Birmingham for a while in the early 90's.

 

did he die in a car crash a few years ago, or is that someone else i'm thinking about?

Edited July 26, 2008 by Gunga Din

[Runehammer]

Yeah I remember him playing for Spurs in the 60's, hard as nails. There's a famous picture of him having Bremner by the throat after the horrible little ginger git attempted to "do him" on his return from a particularly bad leg break.

 

He retired from football in the late 90's.

[floyd]

did he die in a car crash a few years ago, or is that someone else i'm thinking about?

Must be someone else, as he's still here today.

By all acounts fanastic midfileder, and a bloody hard but fair one.

 

[John am Rhein]

and I ws reading that Clough signed him for Derby and converted him into a sweeper - and he went on to share the Footballer of the Year award.

 

Only 22 caps for Scotland, though, which given how good he apparently was sounds like it should have been abut 4 times that. Presumably him and Bremner played alongside each other for Scotland?

[Cam]

did he die in a car crash a few years ago, or is that someone else i'm thinking about?

Nope, that was Princess Grace of Monaco.

[fyds]

Yeah I remember him playing for Spurs in the 60's, hard as nails. There's a famous picture of him having Bremner by the throat after the horrible little ginger git attempted to "do him" on his return from a particularly bad leg break.

 

He retired from football in the late 90's.

That's right - I remember him playing too - always had a bit of a thing with Smithy, who respected him. Hard as nails but fair is right - if I remember right, he had that bad leg break you mentioned, came back and Cissé like got another - the same leg I think - broken not long after. Good passer of the ball in an early Souness stylee.

[Runehammer]

Must be someone else, as he's still here today.

By all acounts fanastic midfileder, and a bloody hard but fair one.

 

 

 

That's the one, it seems fairly tame now and not at all how I remember the incident!

 

Hard but fair yes, as I recall most of the hard men back then were fair, it was also criminal that he got so few caps for Scotland but back in the 60's up into the 80's there was a policy of not selecting "anglos" if it was avoidable.

[Guest Pedro]

A truly mighty player.

 

My Dad's side of the family were/are Jambos and they say he was a graceful and very skillful footballer. And then there are the tales of being hard as nails as well.....

 

The picture with Bremner is great. Poor Billy sh@t himself!

 

I think I even remember a story of when a ref sent him off and he simply wouldn't go. The ref let him stay on. I know I shouldn't condone that but ...!

[John am Rhein]

That's the one, it seems fairly tame now and not at all how I remember the incident!

 

Hard but fair yes, as I recall most of the hard men back then were fair, it was also criminal that he got so few caps for Scotland but back in the 60's up into the 80's there was a policy of not selecting "anglos" if it was avoidable.

 

But I see that Bremner - who was also an IMMENSE player - that I CAN remember - got 54 caps. Strange really.

[Gunga Din]

But I see that Bremner - who was also an IMMENSE player - that I CAN remember - got 54 caps. Strange really.

 

 

and Alan Hansen only got 24. stranger still

[John am Rhein]

Hansen often failed to perform at international level and he had some pretty strong rivals for the position: Gordon McQueen, Willie Miller, etc.

 

Mind you, they often said Dalglish failed to perform and he got 102 caps (!)

[Gunga Din]

Hansen often failed to perform at international level and he had some pretty strong rivals for the position: Gordon McQueen, Willie Miller, etc.

 

Mind you, they often said Dalglish failed to perform and he got 102 caps (!)

 

you arent seriously trying to tell me that either Willie Miller or Gordon McQueen were as good as Hansen? Hansen was the outstanding centre half in Europe for a decade.

[Runehammer]

Hansen suffered mostly from the Aberdeen mafia! He didn't help his case with that shocking blunder at the World Cup but it was mainly down to Ferguson. No way on earth was Dalglish going to be omitted, he was exempt from any cross-border bias.

 

This anti-anglo policy was never official and really needs some old Scots fellows to try and clarify, it was certainly bizarre how some players suffered from it and others didn't.

[John am Rhein]

you arent seriously trying to tell me that either Willie Miller or Gordon McQueen were as good as Hansen? Hansen was the outstanding centre half in Europe for a decade.

 

In a Scotland shirt yes, Willie Miller was better than Hansen. I don't think Hansen was actually as good as you're saying there, although he was obviously pretty good. I reckon in a Liverpool shirt he looked better due to having Thompson and Lawrenson alongside him. He was down the pecking order for Scotland even before Ferguson took over and Ferguson wasn't actually in charge for long.

[John am Rhein]

This anti-anglo policy was never official and really needs some old Scots fellows to try and clarify, it was certainly bizarre how some players suffered from it and others didn't.

 

You even saw the opposite at times - with someone like Alan Brazil getting in the team for no apparent reason.

[Paddy 66]

In a Scotland shirt yes, Willie Miller was better than Hansen. I don't think Hansen was actually as good as you're saying there, although he was obviously pretty good. I reckon in a Liverpool shirt he looked better due to having Thompson and Lawrenson alongside him. He was down the pecking order for Scotland even before Ferguson took over and Ferguson wasn't actually in charge for long.

That is rubbish, it really is, Hansen was absolute class and looked class whoever he played next too, he was certainly one of the best, if not the best CB in Europe in his prime, that is a fact.

[Billy Dane]

Hansen was superb, as was Mackay. Their omission from the Scotland team was more to do with lunacy/alcoholism of the respective Scottish manager at the time.

[John am Rhein]

That is rubbish, it really is, Hansen was absolute class and looked class whoever he played next too, he was certainly one of the best, if not the best CB in Europe in his prime, that is a fact.

 

No he was overrated. Nowhere near the best in the League, let alone in Europe.

[Billy Dane]

Just for the entertainment value, who was better in the league than Hansen when he was playing?

[John am Rhein]

Just for the entertainment value, who was better in the league than Hansen when he was playing?

 

Mark Lawrenson and Phil Thompson for a start

 

Basically Hansen gets overrated because of the style of football he played - very comfortable on the ball, etc. Still very good, of course, but not the best.

[Billy Dane]

Hansen just had the edge on Lawrenson for me. Not much to choose between them tbf. I don't think Thompson is a fair comparison as he was coming to the end of his career as Hansen was just starting to make his mark. Hansen's best years were probably 83-88, whereas Phil perhaps reached his peak in 81.

[John am Rhein]

Well certainly there was a time when Hansen was better than Thompson. What I meant was that i think Thompson at his best was a better player than Hansen at his best.

 

There was also the Italian Collovati who certainly looked a stronger player than Hansen at international level - harder to compare what they were like at club level in those days, of course.

 

Karl-Heinz Förster was a good one too - definitely better than Hansen (or just about anyone) at international level, but possibly not at club level. Hard to say.