mooks

Kahnee - only a cretin would think the point of my post was that we should sign players whose parents have been "horribly" murdered. I am not ignoring your point - I am saying there is no point for me to ignore as you have created a straw man argument. Suggesting I said it was a positive that his parents had been murdered and then arguing against it is pointless. And tasteless.

Such a player? Are you continuing with your macabre "jokes" about signing players whose parents have been murdered? Or are you saying a player with strength of character and maturity (which is the only point I was making) is "equally as likely to go off the rails"?

I see it as relevant that a player has the strength of character and the maturity to overcome personal tragedy. I think such a player is likely to have the values that epitomize "The Liverpool Way". I believe such a player is not likely to cheat, dive, bite opponents and then claim he wants to leave because he is being given a hard time. All relevant to me. That we should sign players whose parents have been horribly murdered? To be fair, and to be kind, that is an absurd interpretation of the point I was making.

Classy response

Having outed myself as a Suarez-hater when he appeared on the verge of leaving the club I have to say that one of the things that attracts me about bringing in someone like Victor Moses is his character. For more on that I have highlighted the relevant portions of the article below for those, like Leo, who can't be arsed to read the whole thing. In terms of his ability, I would say his main weakness is a lack of end-product (so far). I didn't realise that he was a prolific striker in youth football and, at 22 (the same age Henry was when he came to Arsenal) there could be room for drastic improvement in his goalscoring ratio. His main strengths are his ability to get past players (although I would say his speed is average) and his disciplined play. He tracks back effectively and does the job he is instructed to do. He had a grand total of 0 yellow cards last season and averaged one a season at Wigan. No wonder tactical managers like Rafa and BR rate him. I understand the point some are making about the club insisting on an option to buy at the end of the season. It sticks in the craw to feel that Liverpool are Chelsea's loan club and that if he has a decent season with us that it will ultimately benefit CFC. But unless there are better alternatives out there at a reasonable price I think this will be a wise move to bring him in. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Victor Moses: they should be proud of me, looking down being proud http://www.theguardian.com/football/2012/sep/14/victor-moses-interview-chelsea David Hytner The Guardian, Friday 14 September 2012 22.00 BST To Victor Moses, the images have a dream-like quality. The Nigeria winger had prayed since the beginning of July for the completion of his transfer from Wigan Athletic to Chelsea and there had come a point when he feared that it would not happen. But, in a whirlwind week at the end of August he signed for £9m, was introduced to the Stamford Bridge crowd before the Newcastle United game, felt his eyes widen and his stomach flip during his first training session and then, the finale, watched the European Super Cup against Atlético Madrid as an unused substitute. Moses speaks in shy, hushed tones but they do not disguise the awe and excitement that he feels. His arrival at Chelsea marks a significant staging post in his quest to reach the game's summit, even if it pales in comparison to his broader journey from the depths of personal tragedy. His parents were murdered in Nigeria and Moses fled to England as an 11-year-old asylum seeker. He feels that they look down on him with pride. Moses's focus is on the future and the opportunities that he intends to grasp. He hopes to make his debut at some stage of the grudge fixture at Queens Park Rangers on Saturday, although to give it such billing feels crass in the light of what he has lived through. The 21-year-old bristles with quiet determination. He was Chelsea's final attack-minded signing of the summer, following Eden Hazard, Marko Marin and Oscar, who joined at a total cost of £60m, and with Juan Mata and Ramires also vying for prominence in Roberto Di Matteo's line of three behind the main striker, the competition for places is ferocious. It is reasonable to wonder whether Moses, who was Wigan's main man last season and is becoming something similar for Nigeria, will enjoy the minutes that a talent like his wants and needs. He had no hesitation, though, in signing up for the challenge. "I don't really know if it was Di Matteo or if it was the chairman or whoever but I knew that Chelsea were interested in me and that was it, really," Moses says. "For a club to come and get you, they are going to use you at some stage. I know that there are a lot of players at Chelsea but if I do get my chance, I just have to grab it." Moses already has Chelsea stories to tell. He smiles when he recalls standing on a chair in Monaco, in the build-up to the Super Cup final, and being ordered to sing and dance for the amusement of his team-mates. The initiation routine for new recruits has become a feature at many clubs. "I was nervous," Moses says. "I thought: 'What am I going to sing?' because when I stood there, I literally didn't know what to sing." For the record and the grime fans out there, Moses "kind of sang a Skepta song". "It's a little bit embarrassing," he says, "… everyone watching me, thinking: 'What is he singing?' But it was all right." Moses has needed more than the occasional superlative of late. "The first training session was unbelievable … seeing JT, Ashley Cole, Torres and people like that, it was incredible, kind of crazy," he says. "And the Super Cup, when I was watching it, I was thinking to myself: 'I can't actually believe that I'm here.' I didn't get on but I still got a [runners-up] medal." Moses's appetite for precious metal, though, has been fired by a different encounter. "I saw the Champions League trophy the other day, it was at the training ground," he says. "Everyone was having their picture taken with it but not me. It was the players that played in the Champions League. I just walked away, although I did touch it. I thought to myself: 'Hopefully, we will win it again this year.'" Moses's single-mindedness and strength of character is evident and it is easy to connect it with the manner in which he has coped with his childhood trauma. His father, Austin, was a Christian pastor in Kaduna, and his mother, Josephine, helped with his work. Violence, though, was depressingly familiar between the Muslim majority and the Christian minority and when riots erupted in 2002, Moses's parents, who were obvious but unflinching targets, were attacked in their home and killed. Moses was given the news as he played football in the street. He became a target, too, and, after being hidden by friends for a week, he was sent to England, where he was placed with foster parents in south London. Upon his arrival in the country, he knew nobody. "Definitely, wherever they are at the moment, they should be proud of me, looking down being proud," Moses says of his parents. He is not ready to open up publicly about the bereavement and the gamut of emotions that he has run, but he does reflect on the work ethic that has guided him and been in place from the outset. "It has been a long journey [from Nigeria] and I just want to keep strong and work hard for myself, whether it's football or not football," Moses says. "I have to thank God for being where I am, it's like a dream come true and, if I keep working hard, who knows, I'll probably end up in Barcelona one day." Moses has fond memories of the street-football days in Nigeria – "No boots, just in your bare feet, a little ball got chucked in and we started playing" – and, also, the English after-school equivalent. He always wanted to be a professional footballer and he was spotted by Crystal Palace as he kicked a ball about in Norbury Park. They brought him into their academy and recommended him to Whitgift, the fee-paying school in Croydon where he could benefit from the superb facilities. He was a prodigy, utterly prolific in front of goal, a man among boys. He led the Whitgift under-14 team to the FA Youth Cup in 2005; they beat Grimsby school 5-0 in the final, with Moses scoring all five. Grimsby played in red shirts, which prompted the Grimsby Evening Telegraph into the first of many bible-based headlines for the player: "Holy Moses – wonder player parts red sea." He made his Palace debut at 16 and was called up by England at every youth level. He won the Golden Boot at the European Under-17 Championship in 2007, in which England lost to Spain in the final, but his momentum was checked at Under-21 level. Stuart Pearce fielded him only once, against Uzbekistan in 2010, and the manager substituted him at half-time. Moses was not called up for the next game. "I played for England Under-16s, 17s, 18s, 19s, 20s and then 21s … then … I just decided to make the decision to play for Nigeria," he says. Moses based the decision, in part, on where he felt full international opportunity would knock. He was conscious, he says, of the "great players" that England produce. "Every year," he adds, "you can see young players coming up and doing really well." His declaration for Nigeria has thrilled fans across Africa, where the Premier League is revered, although it did prompt Pearce into a hurried phone call to ask him what he was doing. Moses has his eyes on the Africa Cup of Nations that takes place in South Africa from 19 January-10 February next year, at which Nigeria will compete if they can see off Liberia in the second leg of the final qualifying round. They drew the first leg 2-2 in Liberia last Saturday, with Moses setting up both of his team's goals. The return is in Calabar on 12 October. "When I got to Nigeria [last week], everyone seemed to support Chelsea," Moses says. "It was a good experience to see Chelsea fans in Nigeria, screaming my name and stuff. When I got to Liberia as well, it was the same thing. They watch the Premier League everywhere in Africa." The topsy-turvy nature of Moses's recent existence is epitomised by his having played more matches this season against his current employer than for them. He completed the 90 minutes for Wigan against Chelsea on the opening weekend, which was a test of his professionalism, particularly as he says he knew Chelsea had made a bid for him before the kick-off. "Wigan must have rejected it," he says. They rejected four bids in total, starting with £3.5m in early July. Moses is desperate to impress and he says that he has no preference about where he plays. "I feel comfortable anywhere up front," he says. "Left wing, right wing, behind the striker. I thought that the transfer wasn't going to happen because it did drag on a bit but I'm delighted that everything is sorted. I just want to enjoy myself and play football."

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I predict Moses will be a solid success for us - not necessarily a revelation along the lines of Sturridge and Coutinho but he will improve our side. He is the anti-Downing - a hard worker who makes the most of his talents but with just enough flair to make key contributions in the final third. If this comes off, in a way it shows how Rodgers' job has been made a bit easier by us falling out of the top 4. Can you imagine Chelsea agreeing to loan us Moses if they still saw us as direct rivals?

How Victor Moses can be another coup for Liverpool By This Is Anfield on August 26, 2013 Following reports that Liverpool are interested in taking Chelsea attacker Victor Moses on a season loan, we get the opinion of Crystal Palace season ticket holder David Matthews – who watched Moses development at Selhurst Park and has closely followed his career since. http://www.thisisanfield.com/2013/08/victor-moses-coup-for-liverpool/ For any Liverpool fans feeling slightly underwhelmed by the potential arrival of Victor Moses from Chelsea on a seasons long loan, hopefully I can give you an insight into what you will be getting from the 22 year old Nigerian International and give you cause for optimism. As a 14 year old, Moses was one of the most exciting Academy players in the country. And thankfully for us at Selhurst Park, he belonged to us. Once he finally broke into the Palace first team, there was no looking back, and it was only a couple of niggling injuries that stopped him being a regular starter at the age of 17. Talent His talent was obvious. Blessed with the ability to glide past defenders with the ball as if they were training ground manikins, he bought an excitement to Palace fans that we probably hadn’t seen for a very long time. He continued this trend at Wigan, were he was instrumental in their Houdini survival act two seasons ago. Two devastating performances in wins at home to Manchester United and away at Arsenal ensured Wigan remained in the Premier League, but Victor had already caught the attention of Chelsea and manager then Roberto Di Matteo. Last season, Victor was always playing second fiddle to the tremendous trio of Eden Hazard, Juan Mata and Oscar. But former Liverpool manager Rafa Benitez took a real liking to Moses and utilised him a lot, especially in their run to Europa League Glory. But with Chelsea and Jose reunited, it seems Victor is surplus to requirements at Stamford Bridge this season. And Liverpool could be a perfect fit for him. It’s worth noting that Moses perfectly suits the type of player Liverpool’s owners are wishing to sign; still young (22), with plenty of experience but also plenty of potential for further development. I would expect Liverpool would look to have a clause to make the deal permanent should they agree a loan deal. Left Forward Moses’ best position is arguably the left forward in a 4-3-3/4-2-3-1 formation – the area which Rodgers has explained his is looking to strengthen, thus allowing Philippe Coutinho the freedom of the ‘number 10′ role more centrally. Unlike Coutinho, Moses prefers to do the majority of his work in a wide position, relishing the opportunity to take on full backs before cutting inside onto his stronger right foot. Give him space, and he’ll exploit 1v1 opportunities with ease. He has tremendous feet, wonderful balance, and a great change of pace. He is a natural with the ball, and would be a real asset to Liverpool. In games this season where the opposition will plan to restrict the likes of Coutinho playing between the lines in central areas, Moses would give Liverpool some genuine width on the left hand side. Much like other Liverpool signings this summer – Kolo Toure and Simon Mignolet – Moses might not be the most glamorous signing on paper, but it wouldn’t surprise me if this signing is looking somewhat of a coup come May…

We'll see ...

Do you mean that if we don't finish in the top 4 the season will be a failure? I would be very hesitant about setting that as our minimum target. A strong challenge that falls short will be sufficient progress for me for BR to get a (probably 1 year) extension to his contract.

Moses would be an excellent addition - he's not dissimilar to the Kuyt of 4-5 years ago. Sure. We'll have Hazard on loan while we're at it.

1. Sturridge 2. Mignolet 3. Toure

I think we should wait just a tad longer than two games before coming to such conclusions.

Ready to achieve what exactly? What are people's expectations for this season? I suppose my benchmark is Houllier's second season. Having finished 7th in a difficult, transitional first season and without European football as a distraction his methods started to click and we finished 4th when only the top three qualified for the Champions League and came within a whisker of third. I realise that no comparisons can be exact and the mega-riches of City and Chelsea have distorted the picture but my minimum expectation is that we will at least be in contention to finish in the top four in April.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TdcQkOuMfmc I refer you to 1:18 for evidence of how badly his standards had slipped in the second half of the season Edit: Howler against City? Leo, for a poster I like and admire you really need to take a good look in the mirror. You're spouting tabloid c**p in order to attack our best keeper in a generation - who, by the way, is still a Liverpool player.

Precisely - FSG are a completely different (more responsible) ownership than H&G

At the Kop end

Mignolet's debut couldn't have gone better if he'd written the script himself. Let's hope he carries on.

Right - and is this the same keeper who missed a number of games during the first half of the season due to a niggling injury? But it is a FACT that he needed to lose weight because he had lost focus and drive. Carry on.

El Hadji Diouf scored two goals for us in his first league game at Anfield. I am waiting to pass judgment on Mignolet - shouldn't we all?

Based on that reasoning Stewart Downing was a huge improvement to our team. Fact?

Mignolet? Based on what?

Why posting this now?

Thoughtful piece. Interesting that Rafa is changing the entire way Napoli play after finishing second last season. He has brought in a number of new players, though, so it's very different in that respect to his spell at Inter. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Marek Hamsik's creativity ideal for Rafa Benitez's Napoli revolution http://espnfc.com/blog/_/name/tacticsandanalysis/id/1726?cc=5901 It has been an exciting summer of coaching changes across Europe: The top seven favourites for the Champions League, the top three in England, the top two in Spain, plus the champions of France, Germany and Portugal all started 2013-14 with a new manager. In Italy, somewhat surprisingly, it's been quieter. Of last season's top four, Juventus' Antonio Conte, Milan's Max Allegri and Fiorentina's Vincenzo Montella remain in their positions having performed extremely impressively, albeit in different ways, last season. If it's unusual to see few coaching changes amongst the top four in Serie A, it's particularly odd that Napoli are the exception. Previous coach Walter Mazzarri was the longest-serving coach in Serie A, but his departure led to the appointment of Rafael Benitez, back in Italy after a season at Chelsea, which was preceded by his disappointing period in charge of Inter. Of all the major coaching changes across Europe, perhaps Benitez is set to embark upon the grandest revolution. So far, we've noted how David Moyes' approach has been broadly similar to that of Sir Alex Ferguson, how Pep Guardiola has still used flying wingers and a proper centre-forward, how Gerardo Martino still wants heavy pressing from Barcelona, how Jose Mourinho has stuck to the 4-2-3-1 Chelsea have played over the past couple of seasons. Benitez's approach, however, will differ completely from that of his predecessor. Napoli were one of the most distinctive sides in Europe over the past three seasons, playing a counterattacking system featuring three centre-backs, flying wing-backs and a versatile front three. Benitez has a completely dissimilar approach and is set to introduce his template system: 4-2-3-1, defending in two banks of four, remaining compact and using genuine wide players. The transformation is enormous. In conjunction with the change in strategy, Napoli also need a new leader. Not necessarily a leader in the old-fashioned sense, not an inspirational captain -- but instead a "technical leader," someone who Napoli can depend upon to inspire their attacking play. Edinson Cavani, last year's capocannoniere, was previously Napoli's key man -- and while his departure to PSG was followed swiftly by the signing of Gonzalo Higuain to play the centre-forward role, the Argentine doesn't quite have the same aura, the same character as Cavani. Instead, Benitez's key player will be Marek Hamsik. After the departure of Ezequiel Lavezzi and Cavani to PSG in consecutive summers, Hamsik is the final piece of Napoli's terrific attacking trio remaining. Earlier this month, he signed a new contract, tying him to Napoli until 2018. Until last season, Hamsik always appeared rather overrated. Immediately noticeable because of his haircut rather than his football, the Slovakian didn't offer the raw creativity needed from a man in that position, perhaps because Napoli played on the counterattack and therefore didn't require a neat midfielder capable of playing through-balls. He was famed for his energy and the timing of his runs into the penalty box, and he describes his best quality as "an eye for goal -- I'm drawn towards the goal, and I'm always looking for an opening.” Things changed last season, however, and Hamsik became a different player, a creative force. He topped the Serie A assist charts with 14, partly because he was afforded a greater, more prominent role in the side following Lavezzi's departure. In all competitions, he recorded an assist every 2.5 games, up from every 4.5 games the previous campaign. It was also the first season he created more goals than he scored. Under Benitez, he should become even more pivotal. Throughout Napoli's preseason, he's been tremendous, driving the side forward like the Hamsik of old, yet providing the incision of last season. He was the standout performer at the Emirates Cup, providing an assist for a Goran Pandev goal with a clever, well-timed pass with the outside of his right foot. "What's my ideal position? I just adapt, I really don't have a preference,” Hamsik insisted. "I can operate in a three-man attack or just behind two front men. It's all fine by me." The central attacking midfielder in a 4-2-3-1 is neither of those things, however, and that player has generally excelled in Benitez's teams. At Valencia he signed the wonderful Pablo Aimar before moving on to Liverpool, where (after a surprisingly long period) the manager realised Steven Gerrard was best placed at the top of a midfield triangle. Questioned about whether Hamsik can play the Gerrard role for Napoli, Benitez didn't reject the comparison. More recently, Juan Mata had an outstanding campaign last season when fielded in his favoured, central No. 10 role by Benitez. Interestingly, the form of both Aimar and Gerrard dipped after they stopped playing for Benitez, while Mata seems unlikely to receive such support from Jose Mourinho. The exception to the rule is Wesley Sneijder, who hated playing under the Spaniard at Inter and grumbled about his positional duties. "I got frustrated under Benitez ... he wanted me to play as a striker,” Sneijder complained. In truth, however, Sneijder was using this as an excuse for his own underperformance -- he had played a similar role under Mourinho in the Champions League, and the acclaim he received for his 2010 World Cup was primarily because of his goal scoring. There are a couple of interesting subplots as Hamsik becomes Napoli's key player. The first concerns whether he can play consistently well outside of Mazzarri's system. There's a sneaking suspicion that Mazzarri got the best out of individuals because they were perfectly suited to such an unusual formation, and, as mentioned 18 months ago, few Napoli players have replicated their Napoli form outside Mazzarri's structure. Lavezzi's poor displays for PSG and Christian Maggio's inability to play right back effectively for Italy, having grown accustomed to a wing-back role, have added to that impression. The second is about the nature of Hamsik's No. 10 role: whether he plays more as a proper playmaker, or as a midfield driver. As previously discussed, Serie A has slightly fallen out of love with the No. 10 and currently prefers powerful, energetic attacking midfielders. Either way, it will be fascinating to see Hamsik's development this season. His agent, Juraj Venglos, said earlier this week that "there is already a good understanding [between Hamsik and] Gonzalo Higuain" -- and with Jose Callejon and Dries Mertens attacking from the flanks, Hamsik finds himself with great responsibility in a side that should challenge for the title.