Davvo

careful, that could be misconstrued, comma or not.

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Keyboard's make warriors brave.

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The 1% just seemed a bit token, and let's be honest what would 1% improvement do ? I think 90-10 would be more accurate for the on-field issues. Not to take away from the sheer f***ing w***ishness of the owners, which I guess is why you'd be reluctant to drop their share of the blame below 99% (and I do understand that), but my one issue at the moment is that I think Rafa's battening down the hatches to see through the s*** storm of injuries etc, rather than trying to change our luck. I'm still behind him, I just don't agree with the masch/lucas partnership, and the stats on conceding from set pieces are starting to justify the t***s I'd previously been telling to f*** off. 10% of the blame (shared with the players in some part) is certainly not sufficient to sack the man. I know we'll turn this around, just wish we'd start to look like we might. I'm guilty of putting way too much hope on Aquilani changing our use of the ball and speed of play from midfield, but the longer he's getting splinter's in his a*** the more the pressure builds.

This is it for me, and the fact is both can play well yet actually be the route cause of our problems, all in the same game. It's not about how well they perform their roles as individuals, but how effective it is within the overall team performance. If we're talking about defending, then you also have to point fingers at your defensive midfield players. Manger's and players are always going on about how you defend as a team, it's not just the back four. I don't blame Rafa for the length of Aquilani's absence, and I'm happy to believe there's good reason he's not playing now, but there's no reason not to switch Stevie back in there and try and get us moving forward quicker.

Good summary of where we're at that.

Agreed, Kev should have stuck that 17 point monster up first post, although I do feel he could have made the same points whilst consolidating it to about 8 or 9 As for the considered responses, they're coming from the usual considered posters, the torch carriers have ignored them, or not read them, or both?

No I didn't say that, but don't let that stop you knee-jerking in reaction to what you think you've read, and what you think my opinion is. It was written in plain English, read the words, not what you mistakenly think is between the lines.

I see what you're saying now mate, but not sure of the answer. I'd suggest the knee jerkers would still be there, but the more balanced critics would have one less sword to attack with. If we were playing in the same manner as Feb-May, then you'd be hard pushed to call it anything other than horrendous luck, but I agree there could be some calling for more caution (the same who are now calling for less caution). So you are right there would be an element of damned if you do damned of you don't, and I guess that's always going to exist in a sport with such polarised opinions.

by the same token, is it not also natural that a passionate fan would over react and kneejerk ? People react in different ways to this kind of adversity, they attack or they defend. A bit like the team to be honest. If people feel Kev's posts contain nothing worth debating, they should ignore them. It's noticeable that there is a not insignificant number of posters more willing to flay Kev, and accuse of him of not backing up his arguments, than to take on the more considered criticisms from other posters. I agree, it's natural for people to want to defend their club when being attacked, but the kind of mob response to Kev is only likely to fuel the nonsense to be honest, it doesn't get us back to reasoned debate.

They outnumber Kev.

Are you saying that having played so well late last season, it's natural to be more cautious this season just incase we didn't get the same results our good play got last season ? Sorry, but that response makes no sense to me at all.

behave. off the top of my head, I remember at least one stating 99% owners fault, 1% Rafa's fault. That's close enough to blameless for me, because 1% improvement would change f*** all. There's people saying Rafa can't be blamed for our defending, despite the fact the same players continue to make the same mistakes. I don't like Kev's rants anymore than the next man, but he's entitled to them as a fan, and he's considerably outnumbered by outspoken apologists. Like I said, there are more and more people becoming more balanced on this whole s*** storm, but not enough, and it's not all one way.

to be fair, the people who refuse to apportion any significant blame on rafa, are equally delusional to those who blame him almost solely. If there was some kind of admission from the "head in sand, hand on liver bird" brigade, that Rafa is not helping himself with some decisions (and some are starting to since the City game, but not enough), then there could be some debate. Equally, the one or two people* who think it's all on Rafa need to tone down the knee-jerking. *by one or two, I'm referring to prolific posters, not those who only come out of the woodwork during match thread's or to vote on polls. The head in sand guys most definitely outnumber the knee-jerkers. Either way, more people need to move to the centre on this, instead of playing the superfan card.

Agree with a lot of that post, and it's also a very considered and respectful assessment. Makes you wonder why there's no comment from those crying out for someone to criticise constructively, instead of knee jerking. You've done that, and made some very valid points, but they get ignored. Instead people continue to jump on Kev, who in my opinion is just a loyal fan who's thoroughly f***ed off and needs a place to rant. I have no problem with such ranting on a forum, it's at the ground where I have a problem with it. I don't want Rafa out either, I want him to address our defending and play a little more openly. For the last 3 months of last season the team visibly opened up and attacked more, and the result was a side the equal of any in Europe. This season we've gone back in our shell, and whilst it may be a response to adversity, it's not the correct one. Any team will suffer with the injuries we've had this year, terrible, terrible luck, but battening down the hatches is not the answer. How do you breed confidence by pulling more and more people back to cover for your demoralised and disorganised defence ?

It's his ego that's bruised, not his toe.

No, but I'm f***ing sick of seeing Lucas sat next to Mascherano, especially when we have no flare or pace outwide. If Aquilani's not fit, then Stevie has to play alongside either of the holding mid's, especially when there isn't the excuse of breaking up Torres/Gerrard. Too many defence minded players on the pitch at the moment.

Babel's comments today suggest to me that the players, and maybe even Rafa have the same opinion as Gray and made it clear to him at the weekend. Stevie certainly didn't hide his disdain for his failure to try and run off the knock. He wouldn't have reacted like that if he didn't have doubt's over the lad's character. If he thought anything of him at all he would not have reacted that way.

and yet he was played for 15 minutes against Arsenal a month ago, when if we'd forced extra time he would have had to play 45. It's not for fitness reasons, it's because Rafa fears breaking up his protective duo infront of our wobbly defence. That attitude is not going to get us out of this hole. Wouldn't surprise me if we don't see him now til the Fiorentina game. When you're in a run of bad form you have 2 options, a) bunker down and battle through it, hoping your luck will change or b) have a go, get up and at em and try and make some luck. I'd like to see b)

There's been worse comments than Kev's to be fair.

not fit enough for 90 minutes was the word I think ? Given our recent spate of injuries during games, I guess we can't afford to start with anyone that's not upto 90 as they may well be needed to stay on.

as expected I guess, and about as strong as could be. Hopefully no accidents or injuries and Aquaman gets a decent run out too, perhaps he could bag the 5th with a 30 yarder