S.O.S - "BELONG" LFC Membership Scheme and Tickets for Corporates

[Spirit Of Shankly]

“Belong". The motto for Liverpool Football Club's new Membership Scheme. Well what if you already 'Belong'? Do you have to cough up £29 or £20, to continue to belong? Or can you still belong, but anyone new who wants to belong, has to pay for the privilege?

 

 

The whole idea of someone belonging to a club is fair and right. But to pay for it, where is the fairness in that? We all belong to Liverpool Football Club. From the minute you were born and had your first picture taken with a Liverpool scarf. Or from when your Dad, Mum, Aunty, Uncle, Cousin, started taking you to the match or when you watched MOTD and realised there was only one club for you. The point is, you didn't start belonging, when you paid YOUR club, a certain amount of money, a membership fee, each year. So why is Liverpool Football Club, a religion to most fans, now charging for you to 'Belong'?

 

 

The "benefits" of this new scheme mean improved access to tickets, in the form of a Ticket Exchange. What about existing fan card holders? Do we have improved access to tickets, such as Window Sales, an Improved Internet service for buying tickets online, or an improved telephone system for buying tickets? How much access do fans get to tickets via this exchange for their fee? Will those subscribing to the new Membership Scheme receive any priority over existing fan card holders? How will the PTS scheme be affected? Will they still have the same number of tickets available to them?

 

 

For your £29 membership fee, you can join the Season Ticket Waiting List. A list that up until this point was free to join. Can people still join the waiting list for free, or do you have to pay to join it? If so what about all those fans presently on the waiting list, what happens to them?

 

 

This Membership, is replacing fan cards. You can no longer buy a £3.50 fan card. So any new fans that previously weren't able to go to the match and haven't got a fan card have to pay £29 a season if they want to realistically even consider going to a game, young kids wanting to start going to games, have got to pay £20 a season. This is just for the CHANCE of a ticket, to be able to record loyalty. Existing fan card holders – well no one seems to be willing to say what exactly will happen to them. What we do know is that an S.O.S Committee Member contacted the Ticket Office about this proposed scheme a few weeks ago. We were told that fan cards would be ok for the 2008/09 season, but not for the 2009/10 season. So what happens to fan card holders then? A card that was described as being the only card you will ever need, is it now going to be rendered useless? They said so. It means everyone has to cough up to stand a chance of getting a ticket. Have they decided sensibly against this? Have they any intention of informing us?

 

 

The Club’s very own charter says this about fancards:

 

 

“The Fan Card is the only card that you will need with Liverpool Football Club”

 

 

http://www.liverpoolfc.tv/club/charter.htm

 

See the section on fan cards. It tells you this. So why the change?

 

 

Did the club consult with supporters? If it has – and in the charter it claims to on a regular basis – then can it release the minutes of those discussions? Do you know of anyone who has taken part in them on this issue? If it hasn’t consulted with supporters, well, why not? We’re the ones who go through the ticketing rigmarole week in, week out. We’re the ones frustrated by the ticket office, by losing tickets to touts. Is it in any way arduous to actually remember simple values of customer service or to carry out surveys? The club calls upon the twelfth man when it requires it and then casts him aside from its thoughts other than as a minor irritant to be bled dry at all other times.

 

 

What about Season Ticket Holders? They currently pay a minimum of £650 per season. Do they get the same benefits of this new membership? Will the receive the discounts and the special offers?

 

 

There are so many questions that the club need to answer. So many questions that we, as fans, need answers to. We will be asking the club for these answers, a letter has been sent to Rick Parry, and to the Ticket Office Manager, asking for answers to all these questions.

 

 

The only answer we have for definite is cost. £29 for adults, £20 for children. Per season. So a family of 4 must pay £98. Per Season. Just to give themselves a chance of getting a ticket in a season. A young supporter, living in the shadows of Anfield, who might want to attend just one game, as they can't afford it regularly, now has to pay £20, just for the 'privilege' of applying for a ticket. This is even before fans have to consider the rises in ticket prices, of £3 per ticket, per game.

 

 

From a one off payment of £3.50 to £29 per season. With an estimated

 

250,000 people holding fan cards, that is £7,250,000 extra revenue per season.

 

The cynic in us, might wonder exactly where that money will be going.

 

 

This isn't like Barcelona, where they have members, who pay their money and have a say. This is pay your money, maybe get a ticket to take your seat and be happy with it.

 

 

We have also learnt today, that the Development Association, who provide tickets to fans (which they pay for) who sell pools on behalf of the club (http://www.liverpoolfc.tv/tickets/devassoc/ ), are to lose their allocation of tickets. Supporters Clubs, many of whom have fans who come every week from all over the country, are to have their ticket allocations cut in half. Where will these tickets go? To Corporates. So less tickets for fans who go every week, everywhere. More tickets for those who swell the clubs coffers, and want to turn up for a “jolly good afternoon of sport”.

 

 

So we will ask the questions. We will get the answers. And we’ll help the club do what it seems to find so hard – tell supporters what is going on. But in the meantime, why don’t you ask the club. Or if the club ignore us, let’s ask the Liverpool Echo to ask questions on our behalf. Email Tony Barrett - tony.barrett@liverpoolecho.co.uk. Lets put pressure on them to ask questions to those who make these decisions, and lets pressure the club in to answering OUR questions.

 

 

Spirit Of Shankly

[Molby]

the way to look at these initiative is like this:

 

new fancard system: if it generates an extra £7m, then that's

a) £7m extra toward debt repayment

b) £7m multipled by a multiple (say 12) to be added on to the value of the club, for when negotiations take place with a potential purchaser, i.e. an increase in value of £84m

c) the increase in value lowers the gearing and therefore strengthens their position with lenders

 

Pools: it's quite straightforward - corporate is worth far more than disparate groups of 'ordinary local fans'

 

generally: as long as supporters take this lying down, G and H can't lose, even if the schemes are not implemented prior to selling on the club, there is value in the blueprint (sound familiar? "here's your stadium blueprint, we won't be taking it forward...you execute it, now give me a shedload of cash")

[PLY]

I've just phoned the Development Assoc and they said that tghey'd been to a meeting today and the plans had been scrapped. Whether that's just the official party line to be repeated before it quietly disappears or whether they're trying to cut down an angle of attck for SOS I don't know

 

Just thought I'd pass on.

[Gunga Din]

I've just phoned the Development Assoc and they said that tghey'd been to a meeting today and the plans had been scrapped. Whether that's just the official party line to be repeated before it quietly disappears or whether they're trying to cut down an angle of attck for SOS I don't know

 

Just thought I'd pass on.

 

 

it was never actually officially rolled out though was it? weren't SoS basing it on someone having spoken to someone in the ticket office?

[Spirit Of Shankly]

it was never actually officially rolled out though was it? weren't SoS basing it on someone having spoken to someone in the ticket office?

 

Basing what, on what? Sorry not quite sure what you are saying here.

[Molby]

it was never actually officially rolled out though was it? weren't SoS basing it on someone having spoken to someone in the ticket office?

 

 

no

 

there are 2 issues

 

the development office thing only came up today and we'll see in due course whether it comes to pass

 

the £29 annual charge was to do with the ticket office, where conversations took place with the manager...but that wasn't the source of it, just a normal conversation that took place in light of hearing the news, in order to try to establish the validity of it

[Gunga Din]

Basing what, on what? Sorry not quite sure what you are saying here.

 

 

the £29 fancard issue?

[Mondavi]

At the risk of being on the end of the usual jibes, a couple of questions/possibilities.

• The reduction in tickets to Supporters Clubs/Pools people. Could this not be to help create a larger pool of tickets for the new membership scheme ?
  
• How much did people used to have to pay to be members of the OLSC ? honestly have no idea as I'm in the PTS so it's "included".
  

I know of a number of supporters club tickets that regularly were being hawked around amongst groups of friends etc, rather than used within the clubs themselves, and to be honest I'd rather they were dished out to people prepared to be "members" of the club.

 

I do despair however, at how difficult it will now become to introduce kids to the game. I took my nephew on for his first game in the CLQ game against haifa without too much difficulty, it seems if I try and do something similar in future it's going to cost a speculative £20 before I start.

 

I'm not totally against the club asking for people to pay some form of membership fee for the "chance" of a ticket, I do it in PTS, and it's my choice whether I do it or not. The idea in the longhaul is that I hopefully get an ST at some point.

 

However, I would like to see a scheme whereby a "member", be it ST/PTS/OLSC/BELONG? can apply for the genny sales tickets for a school age kid (under 12 or similar)who doesn't have a membership of some sort. This is how the fans of the future are formed.

[Guest SpiritualWarrier]

Excellent work SOS.

 

Fully behind you lot and what you stand for, I'll be getting my membership request in when its online and I don't see why any self respecting Liverpool fan wouldn't be behind the causes of which some people have moved their arses for.

 

You are sticking to your aim at holding who ever owns the club to account and are going at it the right way.

 

Well played lads.

[Spirit Of Shankly]

the £29 fancard issue?

 

This is about the fancard issue being £29, but also the fact that allocations for the development association are being taken away to be given to corporates.

 

 

At the risk of being on the end of the usual jibes, a couple of questions/possibilities.

• The reduction in tickets to Supporters Clubs/Pools people. Could this not be to help create a larger pool of tickets for the new membership scheme ?
  
• How much did people used to have to pay to be members of the OLSC ? honestly have no idea as I'm in the PTS so it's "included".
  

I know of a number of supporters club tickets that regularly were being hawked around amongst groups of friends etc, rather than used within the clubs themselves, and to be honest I'd rather they were dished out to people prepared to be "members" of the club.

 

I do despair however, at how difficult it will now become to introduce kids to the game. I took my nephew on for his first game in the CLQ game against haifa without too much difficulty, it seems if I try and do something similar in future it's going to cost a speculative £20 before I start.

 

I'm not totally against the club asking for people to pay some form of membership fee for the "chance" of a ticket, I do it in PTS, and it's my choice whether I do it or not. The idea in the longhaul is that I hopefully get an ST at some point.

 

However, I would like to see a scheme whereby a "member", be it ST/PTS/OLSC/BELONG? can apply for the genny sales tickets for a school age kid (under 12 or similar)who doesn't have a membership of some sort. This is how the fans of the future are formed.

 

The tickets being taken away from the Development Association and from Supporters Clubs aren't going to fans though. They are going to corporates.

 

Good ideas there about the fans of the future.

[The Invisible Man]

In case anyone is interested United have a similar scheme charging fans £28. Arsenal charge £30. Chelsea £25. Everton £20.

And we wonder why we're not raking in as much as other clubs....

Edited July 9, 2008 by Nick17

[Gunga Din]

This is about the fancard issue being £29, but also the fact that allocations for the development association are being taken away to be given to corporates.

 

 

is that a fact or guesswork? might it be that the tickets are going to be going to fancard holders? Where will these corporates sit for example? Will season ticket seats be moved to accomodate them, are will we be expecting them to buy corporate tickets to sit down at the corner of the Anny Rd and Kemlyn?

[Molby]

However, I would like to see a scheme whereby a "member", be it ST/PTS/OLSC/BELONG? can apply for the genny sales tickets for a school age kid (under 12 or similar)who doesn't have a membership of some sort. This is how the fans of the future are formed.

 

 

this bit and variations thereof, are part of the SOS community project

 

the project is in it's infancy obviously, but this kind of grass roots stuff, eg moving reserve games back to Anfield, at least for the big games, and distributing the tickets through schools and other outlets is something we are trying to talk to the club about

[Mondavi]

this bit and variations thereof, are part of the SOS community project

 

the project is in it's infancy obviously, but this kind of grass roots stuff, eg moving reserve games back to Anfield, at least for the big games, and distributing the tickets through schools and other outlets is something we are trying to talk to the club about

 

Good positive stuff, an area that's lacking in my opinion. Obviously coroprates to some extent are a necessary evil, but I'd prefer them to be limited to the boxes to a great extent, and with greater dedicated facilities in a new stadium maybe that will be the case.

 

this new stadium, when it arrives, just has to have a good amount of community seating for want of a better term. It's a great opportunity, and if there can be a balance where to a degree corporates subsidise that, then fair enough. Ironically, the Yanks are pretty good at that kind of thing if Baseball teams are anything to go by, although all it takes is a desire to serve the community and it's future.

[Mondavi]

The tickets being taken away from the Development Association and from Supporters Clubs aren't going to fans though. They are going to corporates.

 

has that been confirmed, or just assumed by the groups mentioned ? Horrendously bad PR by the club if they've actually admitted to that, and also out of order, at least the chosen avenue of re-distribution is anyway.

[Gunga Din]

In case anyone is interested United have a similar scheme charging fans £28. Arsenal charge £30. Chelsea £25. Everton £20.

And we wonder why we're not raking in as much as other clubs....

 

 

sssssshhhhhhh

[Guest SpiritualWarrier]

In case anyone is interested United have a similar scheme charging fans £28. Arsenal charge £30. Chelsea £25. Everton £20.

And we wonder why we're not raking in as much as other clubs....

 

The reason we aren't raking it in as much as other clubs is that we haven't moved with the times, David Moores wouldn't know his a*** from his elbow, Rick Parry is just all about himself. The fact that this ticket scheme being introduced isn't about raking it in, its about paying off the debt, and then making a profit.

[Knox_Harrington]

sssssshhhhhhh

As has been said elsewhere, we can either follow other clubs and remain eternally behind them in this grubby quest for cash or we could find innovative ways to make money and at the same time provide value for money, not a flat tax on the right to have the chance to buy tickets for a football match.

 

I've no problem with LFC making money, I've no problem with that money coming from supporters but to take away a £3.50 one of charge and replace it with £29 a year for essentially the same service (and some "free" s***) is taking the piss. I don't care if every club in the country does it. The club and those associated with it use the support as its worldwide USP and therefore it could have the class and dignity not to rip that support off.

 

(With the exception of the current ownership issue...) If two companies offered the same service, quality and approximate price for a product and I wanted that product and one was LFC and the other was any profit making company then I'd always go for the LFC one to support my club. Isolate this mentality, foster it and cater for it. And inherit the earth.

[Gunga Din]

The reason we aren't raking it in as much as other clubs is that we haven't moved with the times, David Moores wouldn't know his a*** from his elbow, Rick Parry is just all about himself. The fact that this ticket scheme being introduced isn't about raking it in, its about paying off the debt, and then making a profit.

 

 

so how then do you suppose we increase the marketing potential and revenue of the club without getting more money from the fans? i'm genuinely interested in how this can be achieved.

[Gunga Din]

As has been said elsewhere, we can either follow other clubs and remain eternally behind them in this grubby quest for cash or we could find innovative ways to make money and at the same time provide value for money, not a flat tax on the right to have the chance to buy tickets for a football match.

 

I've no problem with LFC making money, I've no problem with that money coming from supporters but to take away a £3.50 one of charge and replace it with £29 a year for essentially the same service (and some "free" s***) is taking the piss. I don't care if every club in the country does it. The club and those associated with it use the support as its worldwide USP and therefore it could have the class and dignity not to rip that support off.

 

(With the exception of the current ownership issue...) If two companies offered the same service, quality and approximate price for a product and I wanted that product and one was LFC and the other was any profit making company then I'd always go for the LFC one to support my club. Isolate this mentality, foster it and cater for it. And inherit the earth.

 

Then you are in for a long and ultimately disappointing ride down the corportae route Knox. New and innovative ideas are great, but i dont see anyone coming up with any that will bring in sufficient funds

 

 

going back to a previous post i made, do we know for sure if the tickets are being taken from supporters clubs and given to corporates or is this just guesswork? also, if it is true, where will these corporate fans sit and will season ticket holders be moved to accomodate them?

[Knox_Harrington]

so how then do you suppose we increase the marketing potential and revenue of the club without getting more money from the fans? i'm genuinely interested in how this can be achieved.

This isn't about the marketing potential. It's simply about revenue.

 

Give it a few hours thought and you can come up with loads of ideas. This isn't the time or place for them and I certainly won't be sharing mine on a public forum.

[Gunga Din]

This isn't about the marketing potential. It's simply about revenue.

 

Give it a few hours thought and you can come up with loads of ideas. This isn't the time or place for them and I certainly won't be sharing mine on a public forum.

 

they go hand in hand, and if it is easy as you think to get ideas that will bring in mass revenue, then why are you not a multi millionaire?

[Guest SpiritualWarrier]

so how then do you suppose we increase the marketing potential and revenue of the club without getting more money from the fans? i'm genuinely interested in how this can be achieved.

 

Right put it this way...

 

How can you justify a £3.50 charge to £29, you can't.

 

One thing is increasing marketing potential, the other is just taking the fans for a ride.

[Knox_Harrington]

they go hand in hand, and if it is easy as you think to get ideas that will bring in mass revenue, then why are you not a multi millionaire?

It's easier if you are LFC as a starting point.

[Gunga Din]

Right put it this way...

 

How can you justify a £3.50 charge to £29, you can't.

 

One thing is increasing marketing potential, the other is just taking the fans for a ride.

 

 

you cant complain we lag behind our main rivals in terms of revenue in one breath, and then complain when we implement similar schemes to them in order to try and improve revenue with another.