Guz

Valencia had some real quality in their ranks before he took over and they were probably more technically able than our current squad in general. And Valencia won those titles with 75 and 78 points at the end of the season. Mancs got 89 points last year, Chelsea 91 the year before and 95 before that. Arsenal in their unbeaten season notched up 90 points. All the top 4 in this country will drop points over the season but there seems to be less mid-table clubs capable of nicking points compared to Spain.

My point is that IF there is/was a deep lying lack of trust in the manager then that's not going to go away over night, even if they sanction a deal for a defender in January.

I dont really know about the stadium or the loan deals. We may yet get a stadium that still looks good and if it gets built, fair enough. And the finance side of things I have no idea about. So as you say let's wait and see. But in terms of their spat with the manager ; it's gone past whether Rafa gets his targets in January, for me. They didnt want to discuss the transfer window with the MANAGER until 2 weeks before the transfer window opened. They didn't want to sanction any deals, even ones that are relatiely small money (Rafa's words) and probably low risk. Benitez only spoke to them and got Foster Gillete to move in next door only after he threw his toys out of his pram to get their attentio. Hicks publically told the Liverpool Echo that Rafa should "quit talking about new players and coach the players we have". Either the owners really have no idea whatsoever about how the transfer window works and the importance of moving quickly, or, and more concering, they do not totally trust the manager with their money. That is worrying.

It's nice to know they think he's so terrific that they wouldnt talk to him about transfers till 3 weeks before the transfer window. If they were so keen to see how his summer signings got on before sanctioning any other activity in the window, even ones that weren't big money as Rafa claimed in one of his interviews, then that's a worry.

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Training?

Wouldnt surprise me if he dropped a couple of clangers on saturday. He's due one

Can anyone think of a mistake by Reina so far this year that has led to a goal? Probably one or two but I cant remember any off the top of my head *touchwood* he doesnt start on saturday...

Something I've noticed when Xabi plays is that if we labour out of defence with the ball really slowly (which we do too often imo) then too much pressure is put on Xabi to make things happen imo. The opposition 'mark up' so to speak and deny us space, the gap between him and the rest of the midfield + forward line gets bigger and Xabi either has to play it long or dwindle on the ball looking for a pass. He does a lot of twisting and turning past whoever is trying to close him down a lot of the time when we're playing s*** because he doesnt have enough decent passing options forward. His role should be to give and receive the ball regularly and keep things flowing, not playing hollywood balls from a deep position. While it's great when they pay off we're not doing our chances of keeping the ball much help. When Sami went off and we changed shape today (not that we had much shape at that point) our players were too far from eachother, we werent anywhere near as compact as we usually are. Thats one of the keys to keeping the ball, you have to keep moving but move as a unit so whoever's on the ball always has an option. When we play well, we're really good. When we're off the boil we stink the place out and are far too static in our movement.

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I hope thats how we shape up - but with Mascherano and Alonso instead of Lucas and Sissoko. My gut feeling is that Lucas will come in for Xabi though. A win at city would be a very important and impressive 3 points. Doesnt matter if we play worse than we did today as long as we come away with 3 points.

Arbeloa - Sissoko

Mashcerano was excellent against pompey but we pressed them high up the pitch as a TEAM. We didnt let them play and gave them no time or space on the ball. The attitude and application as a TEAM was totally lacking today. If we cant feel confident enough to rest a couple of players (especially when it's Xabi Alonso coming in for him) then we're f***ing useless. It was similar against Reading though nowhere near as bad but Masch played then too.

Thats not my point. You implied the luck never goes with the team at the bottom - well it did a bit when we hit the bar. If your lucks always out down the bottom as they all say then you'd expect that to take 17 deflections and nestle into the back of the net off the keeper's a***. I've never understood that and think it's more of a case of s***ter teams being less able to make use of good luck. Gerrard was unlucky with hitting the bar but he didnt give up.

Except when Gerrard hit the woodwork

Hardly done for financial gain though is it? I agree Bellamy was a stop gap before we spent big the following summer on Torres but how you can deduce we signed him so we could make a few million later is beyond me. Kromkamp we didnt lose or make any money on did we? You have to go for short term options when you're building a squad, it's inevitible.

Who exactly has Benitez done that with?

Is right. The first half hour of the 2nd half was probably the worst I've seen us play for years and years. Terrible. We wont be anywhere near that bad against Man City

After the first 30 mins or so we were all complete s****. Not one player came out of that with any crdit until the last few mins

Gerrard off the bar

Torres over with a left foot shot.

Long shot Alonso but good save

Riise moves forward with the ball for 10-15 yards then gives it straight to a white shirt. Awful.

Kuyt over after gerrard cross from the left

Especially when you consider who their manager is!! Pathetic