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HR bods help. Disciplinary issue


quibs

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Right, need some help from the trusted forumites with some advice and HR help.

 

Background

I'm an income officer chasing people to pay their rent. Recently got a new manager who is a pr**k. The day before I went on holiday his side kick sent me a spreadsheet via email with my arrears cases and action that needs to be done on them. Very next day I went on holiday for 3 weeks. This is in august and returned back to work day after bank holiday.

 

Been exactly 5 weeks this week since my return. On Tuesday I get called in by the said manager with HR member. Saying my accounts are not in line with policy. Some not all. Gave me 2 options. Said either take pay out, 2 months salary and 1 month in lieu. Or face disciplinary for negligence which could lead to gross misconduct with potential dismissal if found guilty.

 

Union have said seems being heavy handed. Can't go back to work until I make decision with deadline next Thursday.

 

There has also been a job advertised internally which I have applied for and got interview. But been told by that hr person that I can go for it but would still mean I face disciplinary for current role.

 

So, need some advice please.

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Unions should hopefully be representing you rather than giving you an opinion. Sounds a bit odd all round especially being given an interview by a company threatening you with gross misconduct.

Well for the job interview, the hr people involved in that do not know about it. The managers involved in the interview process are in my team and know the situation. Union have said that I should challenge it.

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They are in Stamford, not that far from you, I will pm you.

Yeah Stamford is not that far. Plus the company have said I can't come into work till I've made a decision so I do have time to get proper advice etc to challenge them.

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Yeah Stamford is not that far. Plus the company have said I can't come into work till I've made a decision so I do have time to get proper advice etc to challenge them.

Can't pm you so will have to do it here. They are called PJH Law and deal exclusively in employment law. 01780 757589. Ask for Philip or Liam. Have helped me out and a n other on this site in the past. They will be up front and honest about your position and there may be a consultation fee, but if your company are willing to pay, then that don't matter. Phone them and speak to them first and see what they say. Check em out on line first if you wish, they have a website and really know their stuff when it comes to this sort of thing. Good luck.

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Gross misconduct can be an extremely difficult to route to go down for a company unless there is no doubt you behaved in a manner that has caused detriment to the company, this would usually be something extremely serious such as violence, theft or destruction of company property etc. Not doing your job effectively would be a performance issue following a proper disciplinary process, outlined in your contract or employee handbook, it is usual and proper for a series of warnings to be given before dismissing an employee for poor performance.

 

Your union should be giving you proper advise and representing you. You are also able to have them attend any meetings regarding this process. Have you had anything in writing from your employer? How long have you been there? Have you faced any previous disciplinary action? How has your performance been historically? What colour underpants are you wearing?

 

 

Or you could just start another thread about about constructive dismissal.

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Can't pm you so will have to do it here. They are called PJH Law and deal exclusively in employment law. 01780 757589. Ask for Philip or Liam. Have helped me out and a n other on this site in the past. They will be up front and honest about your position and there may be a consultation fee, but if your company are willing to pay, then that don't matter. Phone them and speak to them first and see what they say. Check em out on line first if you wish, they have a website and really know their stuff when it comes to this sort of thing. Good luck.

Thanks buzz, I shall call them first thing in the morning.

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I'd definitely contact the lawyer - make certain he's an employment specialist. Let the manager & HR know you are going down this route.

 

Document everything - EVERYTHING that has happened since this new fellah was made your manager - do you still have access to systems / email etc... Document it chronologically.

 

Most of all make certain in your own mind that you are in the right and that you believe, with your lawyer that you can prove this as per your contractual terms / yearly review targets etc. ( You do HAVE yearly reviews, yeah? - if not this is also good as you have no documented targets to aspire to and thus cannot be measured against them - if you have reviews be clear in your own mind that you've met your targets).

 

Similar thing happened to me. They didn't follow redundancy procedure correctly. I knew this, so contacted a lawyer through ACAS. Before he even got involved, I told my HR what I was about to do and they shat themselves. Came out of it pretty well.

 

If you believe you're in the right, and believe you can prove it, fight it like a b*****d.

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Gross misconduct can be an extremely difficult to route to go down for a company unless there is no doubt you behaved in a manner that has caused detriment to the company, this would usually be something extremely serious such as violence, theft or destruction of company property etc. Not doing your job effectively would be a performance issue following a proper disciplinary process, outlined in your contract or employee handbook, it is usual and proper for a series of warnings to be given before dismissing an employee for poor performance.

 

Your union should be giving you proper advise and representing you. You are also able to have them attend any meetings regarding this process. Have you had anything in writing from your employer? How long have you been there? Have you faced any previous disciplinary action? How has your performance been historically? What colour underpants are you wearing?

 

 

Or you could just start another thread about about constructive dismissal.

Once I've made a decision that I don't want payout than they will give exact reason for negligence.

 

Haven't had anything in writing until I say I'm going down disciplinary route.

Been there just over 3 years. No previous disciplinary issues at all. Have had restructure in April and gained more properties under my name. Have the most in the company.

Wearing blue boxers ;)

 

And new thread will be started in a week :)

 

I'd definitely contact the lawyer - make certain he's an employment specialist. Let the manager & HR know you are going down this route.

 

Document everything - EVERYTHING that has happened since this new fellah was made your manager - do you still have access to systems / email etc... Document it chronologically.

 

Most of all make certain in your own mind that you are in the right and that you believe, with your lawyer that you can prove this as per your contractual terms / yearly review targets etc. ( You do HAVE yearly reviews, yeah? - if not this is also good as you have no documented targets to aspire to and thus cannot be measured against them - if you have reviews be clear in your own mind that you've met your targets).

 

Similar thing happened to me. They didn't follow redundancy procedure correctly. I knew this, so contacted a lawyer through ACAS. Before he even got involved, I told my HR what I was about to do and they shat themselves. Came out of it pretty well.

 

If you believe you're in the right, and believe you can prove it, fight it like a b*****d.

 

Still have my ipad and can access everything. Have all my previous 121 notes with old manager. Have only sat down once with this new manager since he took over and that was the day before my 3 week holiday.

 

I do believe that I have done nothing wrong at all. Every income officer is behind or not in line with their work.

 

My arrears figures have come down since April restructure.

 

I believe they should have just put me on performance review and do intend on fighting it.

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If you've done something which they consider to be misconduct, you shouldn't be there.

 

If you are facing disciplinary action they should be providing the details to you with a minimum of delay in writing. From what you're telling us it sounds as though there is something not right. Speak to your union, they can provide legal advise or a solicitor specialising in employment law. As Case suggested, gather as much documentary evidence as possible. You're also within your rights to raise a grievance if you think its appropriate, which your company are obliged to investigate.

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How can they go straight to gross misconduct without prior warnings in writing?

 

Oh, and Buzz's bloke is ace.

 

And how the hell have we got this far into a thread without suggesting this is constructive dismissal? Not like Cobs to miss that one

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Once I've made a decision that I don't want payout than they will give exact reason for negligence..

 

Ehm, why don't they just give exact reasons now? "We want to fire you but we're not telling you why, so why don't you just quit". Lawyers will have them on this.

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You need to get a decent employment lawyer on this, they are all over the show. As you and others have mentioned, should have been a performance review first. They've f***ed it. They can't say 'say you'll go and we'll tell you why', that's quite frankly mental.

 

But you aren't going back here after this so get ready to dig in if you can and get as much from them as possible.

 

Best of luck.

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How can they go straight to gross misconduct without prior warnings in writing?

 

Oh, and Buzz's bloke is ace.

 

And how the hell have we got this far into a thread without suggesting this is constructive dismissal? Not like Cobs to miss that one

 

Gross misconduct has nothing to do with prior warnings?

 

RBM did the CD thing.

 

Carry on.

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Gross misconduct has nothing to do with prior warnings?

Work "not in line with policy" does not equate to gross misconduct.

 

If anything, refresher training should be offered, with improvements to be expected, then further warnings if necessary. But he appears to not only be coping adequately, but actually being extra efficient, especially considering the extra workload.

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Work "not in line with policy" does not equate to gross misconduct.

 

If anything, refresher training should be offered, with improvements to be expected, then further warnings if necessary. But he appears to not only be coping adequately, but actually being extra efficient, especially considering the extra workload.

 

I know...

 

I reckon we'll find the GM will be related to going on holiday without some kind of handover.

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I know...

 

I reckon we'll find the GM will be related to going on holiday without some kind of handover.

No one has ever covered my work while I been on holiday. The holiday was authorised by my previous manager who has now become head of neighbourhood with whom I've never had any problems, had regular 121 and from my understanding been happy cos we got more properties, restructure and the figures were going down.

 

I guess as soon as I say I don't want settlement than they will give me exact reasons for negligence.

 

Ideal world just like it dropped at get the other job in the company which I have interview for next week Thursday.

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