EU Referendum

[Cobs]

I think they had their own referendum in mind. SNP ran a good remain campaign based on their long term goal of exiting the union.

 

well - they had their referendum where they were conned about the UK remaining in the EU, then they back that up by voting to remain in the EU, so whilst the SNP want them out of the UK they still (AFAIK) want to be in the EU

That’s what I meant

In response to workers’ rights, I don’t think the Tories will bother going down that route, which is not the same as saying it isn’t in their wish list

 

But as economic theory will tell you, a wish list is meaningless and demand exists only in the context of desire, willingness and ability to purchase a good

And as for Sunderland, they’re an example of voting on the basis of immigration, not to to support the Tories in dismantling workers’ rights

 

That’s why I use them as an example of why immigration is at the heart of Brexit as opposed to some posh Tory enclave - immigration trumped their own interests

 

Immigration trumped Project Fear

 

buyers regret awaits

 

sadly

[Duncan Disorderly]

There is an argument that only Northern Ireland voted with any brains and thought to their own interests.

The hope of continued peace & prosperity, the EU peace dividend, an all-island economy, the shifting demographics, a more integrated and shared future, ease of travel for work & school & business & vital health procedures etc...

 

Common sense, basically.

Edited October 18, 2019 by Duncan Disorderly

[Ombudsam]

That’s what I meant

In response to workers’ rights, I don’t think the Tories will bother going down that route, which is not the same as saying it isn’t in their wish list

 

But as economic theory will tell you, a wish list is meaningless and demand exists only in the context of desire, willingness and ability to purchase a good

And as for Sunderland, they’re an example of voting on the basis of immigration, not to to support the Tories in dismantling workers’ rights

 

That’s why I use them as an example of why immigration is at the heart of Brexit as opposed to some posh Tory enclave - immigration trumped their own interests

Even if we were to accept your hypothesis on Sunderland, wasn’t the tension that people were saying the Tories will use Brexit to pursue a deregulatory agenda? Even if immigration was a driver for the vote it doesn’t mean the Tories won’t look to maximise capital over labour.

Immigration trumped Project Fear

 

 

I think there’s more than that going on.

 

Anyway when people say less migration, they specifically meant Slavic people didn’t they. I wonder if there were fewer physical differences between them and other white Europeans whether or not the feeling would be a bit different.

[Tosh]

Letwin is key today as it mandates time (ergo an extension) for more scrutiny.

 

Seems that the benefits for NI are being sold (in the Spectator) as being great as they'll have frictionless trade/SM/CU with the EU which will be great for business

 

Matthew Paris saying that we've cut off our own foot in order to escape the "trap" the ERG believes Brussels set

[Dan]

It will be f***ing horrendous on a number of levels if and when this goes through.

[Ripley]

[quote name="Tosh" post="4406197" timestamp="1571468694"

 

Seems that the benefits for NI are being sold (in the Spectator) as being great as they'll have frictionless trade/SM/CU withup the EU which will be great for business

 

Matthew Paris saying that we've cut off our own foot in order to escape the "trap" the ERG believes Brussels set

Fraser Nelson is astonishingly unaware of his own logic.

Edited October 19, 2019 by Ripley

[Molby]

Even if we were to accept your hypothesis on Sunderland, wasn’t the tension that people were saying the Tories will use Brexit to pursue a deregulatory agenda? Even if immigration was a driver for the vote it doesn’t mean the Tories won’t look to maximise capital over labour.

 

t.

No it doesn’t mean that

 

I’m not sure it will be that high on the agenda as people think though as it’s a lot of hassle

 

Specifically what kind of reforms are we talking about?

 

As an aside, consider this:

In France you’re not supposed to make a lot of noise at lunchtime as that’s the time for rest and recuperation (imagine a building site) and on Sundays you’re not supposed to do building work at all

I’m not talking about putting up a few shelves, I’m talking about a site

If you ignore that rule, a neighbour can call the police and they’ll shut you down immediately

 

What do we think about that?

[Guatered]

The hope of continued peace & prosperity, the EU peace dividend, an all-island economy, the shifting demographics, a more integrated and shared future, ease of travel for work & school & business & vital health procedures etc...

 

Common sense, basically.

Well the common sense could be taken further by voting for parties that will actually take up seats in Parliament. SF abstentions may well be enough to see this Brexit through

[Swan Red]

Well the common sense could be taken further by voting for parties that will actually take up seats in Parliament. SF abstentions may well be enough to see this Brexit through

 

You have terrible political opinions

[Redray]

Boris Johnson is currently in Parliament complaining about the unelected elites of the EU. With a straight face.

[Ombudsam]

No it doesn’t mean that

 

I’m not sure it will be that high on the agenda as people think though as it’s a lot of hassle

 

It will be high on the agenda as smoothing the way for capital is why they exist

[muleskinner]

What time is the Letwin vote?

Edited October 19, 2019 by muleskinner

[Ripley]

Boris Johnson is currently in Parliament complaining about the unelected elites of the EU. With a straight face.

And speaking of faces. How much of the permanent smirk of Priti Patel can anyone take?

[Redray]

What time is the Letwin vote?

Being debated now. Expected around 2.30pm. Apparently.

And speaking of faces. How much of the permanent smirk of Priti Patel can anyone take?

None. I'm following it on the Ian Dunt Twitter account. It's the only way

[Murphman]

Caroline Flint being loudly cheered by the Tory benches. She should f*ck off across the floor.

[pipnasty]

Caroline Flint being loudly cheered by the Tory benches. She should f*ck off across the floor.

 

Yer moderates

[£440,000]

Well the common sense could be taken further by voting for parties that will actually take up seats in Parliament. SF abstentions may well be enough to see this Brexit through

SF might well have voted for the deal today.

[Duncan Disorderly]

Well the common sense could be taken further by voting for parties that will actually take up seats in Parliament. SF abstentions may well be enough to see this Brexit through

Are you Karen Bradley?

[StevieC]

 

Anyway, aren't those least exposed to immigration most fearful of immigration

Data showed areas with the biggest % shift in migrant population in past decade that had a correlation with leave.

 

Places like Boston with low numbers of migrants, but nonetheless a recent significant % increase.

 

Easy pray for an anti-immigrant campaign.

[muleskinner]

Data showed areas with the biggest % shift in migrant population in past decade that had a correlation with leave.

Places like Boston with low numbers of migrants, but nonetheless a recent significant % increase.

Easy pray for an anti-immigrant campaign.

Is 1 in 5 of the population born outside the uk a high number or low? Or UK average?

[stressederic]

From twitter it sounds like Starmer is going to town on Barclay.

[StevieC]

Is 1 in 5 of the population born outside the uk a high number or low? Or UK average?

Varies hugely urban vs rural.

 

Point being that an area that was consistently 1:5 would be less likely to leave (on that one regression point) than one which had moved from 0.1:5 to 0.2:5 in the last decade.

[Romario]

From twitter it sounds like Starmer is going to town on Barclay.

I’m watching parliament live and he’s been brilliant. Properly considered discussion.

[StevieC]

I’m watching parliament live and he’s been brilliant. Properly considered discussion.

Unlikely Barclay he’s actually read it.

[Ripley]

Starmer has actually read the thing and in command of his brief. He is taking the opposite front bench's waffle apart.